Wolf hybrids...are some people losing the plot?

[kyrilliondaemon]

Just out of curiosity are you aware of the sheer number of probably more dangerous but perfectly legal (without a license) "pets" there are in the UK?
To be perfectly blunt, as someone who does have an interest in the exotic mammal trade in the UK, I really, really think there're bigger concerns than wolf-dog hybrids - especially given that they do have licensing laws up to a point. They probably shouldn't be bred entirely because hybridisation is generally a bad thing, but as far as the danger goes, I really don't see them as the most worrying thing someone can own without a license.

[p_anda]

Originally Posted by StarlightSerenity

Can I ask (don't have to answer if you don't want to) - have you reported this person?

If you know of cases like these, see adverts etc etc then you (I mean 'you' in a general way, not specifically p_anda) should report them. I don't meant to the website, but to DEFRA or the RSPCA or someone who will take more action than just removing the adverts.

I totally agree with you - they shouldn't be bred, they shouldn't be sold and more needs to be done to protect the animals, prevent the illegal sale of them etc etc etc.

No, I haven't. I have spoken to this person about the way she treats these two animals, and I told her that she should give them up for adoption and give them to someone who can care for them properly. Unfortunately, this person knows my parents and her parents know my parents, and after that the girl's parents told my parents to tell me to stop 'meddling'. So if out of the blue someone knocked on their door to take the hybrids they would know it was me whos' responsible for it and I have no doubt they would give hell to my parents over it [I don't live in the area anymore, so they can't bother me] The girl's family has more sense than money, and they are planning to get another one, so what I said hasn't hit home...

I do report adverts every now and then, but I can't remember a single time anything's been done about them...I don't think people really care to be honest. I guess they can't prove that the breeder has unethical practices or even illegal.

[p_anda]

Originally Posted by kyrilliondaemon

Just out of curiosity are you aware of the sheer number of probably more dangerous but perfectly legal (without a license) "pets" there are in the UK?
To be perfectly blunt, as someone who does have an interest in the exotic mammal trade in the UK, I really, really think there're bigger concerns than wolf-dog hybrids - especially given that they do have licensing laws up to a point. They probably shouldn't be bred entirely because hybridisation is generally a bad thing, but as far as the danger goes, I really don't see them as the most worrying thing someone can own without a license.

Yes, I am aware, and concerned too. But the main problem with hybrids is not that they're dangerous, but rather their popularity. A few years ago I'd never thought they'd be so popular. When only a select few people had access to them, their existence wasn't in the public knowledge, it was fine. But now they are advertised on almost all puppy sites. There are lots of individuals out there who'll think 'ooh cool a half wolf I want one' when originally they might have been looking for a totally different dog.

[StarlightSerenity]

I have to admit, I find the risk to British wildlife more worrying (in respect to non native anmails being released then breeding and causing problems with the ecosystem, greys squirriels for example) than wolf hybrids killing people. But then again, I'm not a big lover of people. My main concern, regarding wolf hybrids, is the suffering of the animals involved.

It's all very well us chatting about it, but what can be done? I don't know the legalities regarding the breeding, keeping and pet market where wolf hybrids are concerned, what's legal, what isn't. Are there any groups out there trying to get them banned or the legislation changed?

[kyrilliondaemon]

The thing is that there's a surprising trade in other exotics too. Not good for any of the animals involved really, so I still can't quite see why the hybrids should be the ones singled out.
Remember when Harry Potter made a worrying number of people buy pet owls? Its just the latest silly fad and in a few years chances are they'll all be stuck in shelters - same as the owls, same as the meerkats will be e.t.c.

Its bad, but I really can't see it as anything exceptional in this case.

[chewy1991]

This has been a big problem in the US for many years. In many places, it is now illegal to own wolves and/or wolf hybrids because too many people have done so irresponsibly. I don't agree with attempting to domesticate a wolf - even if it is by breeding him with a dog. A wolf and a dog may be part of the same family, but they are not the same animal. I can think of one guy I've known to own wolves that seemed to know what he was doing. He realized the animals were not part of his family. He didn't treat them like they were dogs, he treated them like they were wolves who happened to live on his property. Not that I'm defending him, but it is important to point out that he put a lot of work into those animals. One has to put work into owning a wild animal. They're not domesticated. Even tamed ones can have their "moments".

I don't know how it is there, but here in the states... most "wolf hybrids" aren't even really hybrids, anyway. It is a common trend for terrible breeders to mix one of the various nordic breeds with another nordic breed and lie when they call the puppies "wolf hybrids". The people who want these kinds of pets seem to often be gullible enough to fall for the trick and will tell someone like myself and be scoffed at and told "That dog is a Malamute/husky mix. There is no wolf in him except the wolf that is in every domestic dog."

Wolf hybrids are only as dangerous as the people owning them. My concern is that very, very few people know how to properly handle such a pet. Therefore, they do pose some danger. They're not retrievers or terriers. There aren't hundreds of books available to research them. Only small number of questionable ones. They haven't been domesticated for thousands of years. It's just not the same and the people I see that want such a pet seem to think that it is. I've seen so many true hybrids end up on chains or in small kennels because the owner just could not handle them. It isn't fair to the animal.

As far as other dangerous pets go, I will never understand why people own them. But that's a whole other topic.

[racinghamster]

It`s like all the other `fads` in animal breeds that attract the attention of the many and not the few. It becomes legal and then ten years down the line, nothing much can be done about the problems it has caused. Same old story. No real policing of what comes in or what goes out. When I watch those animal rescue programs on TV, it`s sad to see individuals keeping allegators, lizards, snakes like constrictors and various other exotics that get too much for them or are rescued due to sheer neglect. Most of the time it ends in a sad life for the animal, yet the owners don`t seem to realise their limitations. Even keeping something as simple and well established as a pet hamster takes commitment, money and most of all, time and compassion. I wouldn`t dream of even keeping a `different` type of animal unless I sat down and thought ahead about 20 years knowing that I could make that total commitment. Not many people can do that.

[p_anda]

Originally Posted by StarlightSerenity

I have to admit, I find the risk to British wildlife more worrying (in respect to non native anmails being released then breeding and causing problems with the ecosystem, greys squirriels for example) than wolf hybrids killing people. But then again, I'm not a big lover of people. My main concern, regarding wolf hybrids, is the suffering of the animals involved.

It's all very well us chatting about it, but what can be done? I don't know the legalities regarding the breeding, keeping and pet market where wolf hybrids are concerned, what's legal, what isn't. Are there any groups out there trying to get them banned or the legislation changed?

Well, I personally would never attempt to 'liberate' those hybrids, as they attack everything and everyone who isn't a member of the girl's family [only including the family members who live on the property, they are very territorial] and I hope no one tries to steal them or anything like that because I can only imagine what would happen to that person who went in their enclosure. Even if they had good intentions, i.e. to take them to a shelter. I'm not sure how regular shelters will cope with these animals...

I'm hoping the neighbours will alert the police or the RSPCA at some point because the hybrids have already been a problem for them when they were free roaming, I think they killed their cat and got into the chicken coop...I reckon if they find out that the family is planning to get another one, they will have something to say about it. Now, those two live in a 10x10x10 foot pen with a concrete floor and a roof, so yeah, it's not very big. Thing is, it's not like they're in the public eye, the house has a fair bit of land surrounding it and you would never see the hybrids unless you were let onto the land. It's not like any random person would see them and notice how they are kept.

What annoys me that these animals are advertised as if they were just a fancy breed of dog and people are sometimes led to believe they can be kept just like a regular dog. When 99% of the time that isn't the case.

[StarlightSerenity]

Originally Posted by p_anda

Well, I personally would never attempt to 'liberate' those hybrids, as they attack everything and everyone who isn't a member of the girl's family [only including the family members who live on the property, they are very territorial] and I hope no one tries to steal them or anything like that because I can only imagine what would happen to that person who went in their enclosure. Even if they had good intentions, i.e. to take them to a shelter. I'm not sure how regular shelters will cope with these animals...

I never said anyone should do anything like that

I'm hoping the neighbours will alert the police or the RSPCA at some point because the hybrids have already been a problem for them when they were free roaming, I think they killed their cat and got into the chicken coop...I reckon if they find out that the family is planning to get another one, they will have something to say about it. Now, those two live in a 10x10x10 foot pen with a concrete floor and a roof, so yeah, it's not very big. Thing is, it's not like they're in the public eye, the house has a fair bit of land surrounding it and you would never see the hybrids unless you were let onto the land. It's not like any random person would see them and notice how they are kept.

Why don't you just report them to the RSPCA? They won't be told who reported them. If the neighbours have had problems then the owners will have quite a few people who could have done it so won't automatically think it's you.

I think knowing something like this is going on and not reporting it is getting close to being just as bad as doing it to them yourself.

What annoys me that these animals are advertised as if they were just a fancy breed of dog and people are sometimes led to believe they can be kept just like a regular dog. When 99% of the time that isn't the case.

I highly doubt many of them actually are half wolves. Sorry, I just don't think most of them are. They're more likely using it as a sales pitch.

Do you know of any groups or anything then or not? If you've been looking into it for so long surely you know of someone campaigning against breeding/selling/owning them?

[p_anda]

Another thing is the recent increase in dog-fighting in this country... I think a lot of these idiots will see hybrids as an ideal candidate to be used. Considering most fighting breeds are now banned or you need a special permit to own one. It's easier to acquire a hybrid.