Cage/Peer pressure on social media

[Pebbles82]

I would try and depersonalise it as these people are posting randomly on someone else’s channel and not thinking about the person at all. I think the expression used to be “jobsworth”. I have also responded occasionally to correct something. I had one person say my hanster’s cage was dangerous as he only had carpet instead of substrate. Dur! He was running round in a playpen! They just don’t look at the videos properly and fire something off.

[LunaTheHamster1]

Originally Posted by Serendipity7000

I would try and depersonalise it as these people are posting randomly on someone else’s channel and not thinking about the person at all. I think the expression used to be “jobsworth”. I have also responded occasionally to correct something. I had one person say my hanster’s cage was dangerous as he only had carpet instead of substrate. Dur! He was running round in a playpen! They just don’t look at the videos properly and fire something off.

That's funny re your carpet.
She posted on one of my videos - it was when I was first setting up the marrakesh - and i was asking for all of your advice on here as it would be first time having a hamster that wasn't a syrian. I even said in the description of my video that this was all new for me and I even state in the video that I went back and added a platform so no hamster would get squashed. Yet she had to tell me I needed to put everything on platforms or my hamster would get squashed and die. I also suggested she went and watched some of my other videos were you can see my platforms, she then went onto pull Twinkle's cage apart.. should have kept my mouth shut

I think you are right they often only watch one video (probably from a while ago ) and don't look to see what your latest videos look like.

We are always learning, I learn loads from just being on here, but I also think we all need to appreciate that we aren't all coming from the same place or country or have the same finances or big houses and it particularly gets me when people go after kids and upset them when they can do nothing as they are reliant on their parents... my rant over now

oh yes, a jobsworth - not heard that in a while...

[Pebbles82]

There are millions of people out there and YouTube is world wide. Some are normal, some are not! It is insulting that they assume you don’t know what you are doing when you quite clearly have a thriving channel with some amazing set ups. Jealousy?

[LunaTheHamster1]

Originally Posted by Serendipity7000

There are millions of people out there and YouTube is world wide. Some are normal, some are not! It is insulting that they assume you don’t know what you are doing when you quite clearly have a thriving channel with some amazing set ups. Jealousy?

Thanks Serendipity. I must remember to look at the bigger picture I guess. Like you say there are millions of people out there, they are not all going to agree with me. I think I just felt patronised.
Not sure she was jealous, maybe just a bit too passionate(?!) in her beliefs.

I was reading something today that said a 11 inch and a 11.6 inch wheel is too small for a syrian... I just thought, seriously, common sense has to prevail at some point - doesn't it???
.4 of an inch less of a wheel is not going to harm the majority of syrian hamsters.
I see more and more people stating Syrians need a 33cm wheel.

[Pebbles82]

I notice they do make some very large wheels in Germany! 11" is fine for most syrians. I can't see any syrian needing bigger than a 12" (30 cm) wheel! But maybe the 33 cm is more fun to run on or something. Doesn't mean it's necessary.

[hammies3]

I mostly disagree. They mean well, and hamsters deserve more than the absolute bare minimum. I looked up your cage, and in Germany it’s actually considered too small. The rescue I have been in contact with wouldn’t adopt put a hamster to someone with a cage that size. And that’s because it is too small for a Syrian especially. I had one that was of a similar size for a Robo before I upgraded to a larger £30 tub cage and she uses a absolutely every inch in her enclosure except now she can’t bite the bars. I felt like I was doing something wrong when I realised I needed to upgrade, but I got over it because it’s not about me, it’s about the living being that only lives 2 years, so why not make it a good 2 years?

I don’t have a natural set up, I make my hides from cardboard and toilet paper tubes. Space is key.

Lets Talk About Hamster Cages � - YouTube This video explains it all, with the studies linked.

Hamster welfare is number one, I try my best to save money where I can but the bedding really is a huge cost if you’re giving them the minimum 5/6 inches. People should know that and be under no illusions about the cost involved. There are plenty of people giving advice on cheaper set ups, I think the bigger problem we should be talking about is why the bare minimum is seen as a high standard of care because it really isn’t.

[Pebbles82]

Yes it's difficult when there are different guidelines in different countries. There is no actual minimum size in the Uk for a Syrian but most place say 80cm by 50cm minimum and 100 x 50 is a good size. I know in Germany the minimum sizes are much bigger than that. I don't think anyone on here is a fan of small cages! But minimum sizes vary by opinion. Also Syrians can vary in personality and some be much more outgoing than others. For some definitely 100 x 50 wouldn't be big enough, but I have one that prefers the 80 x 50 cage. He has a lot of out of cage time in the living room too and that is something that isn't quite quantifiable - the amount of human attention they get and time out of the cage.

But I totally agree they need enough space at night - in their environment.

That link is really helpful It's the one that has a diagram of size layouts.

[Pebbles82]

Just to add, it can be quite upsetting for some people to find their lovely cage set up criticized. That is why this thread was started really - people finding a lot of pressure over perfectly acceptable set ups and being told their cage is too small. People should not be so quick to criticize and recognise there is a real person on the end of the comment and word things more positively, or pointing out that their point of view is particular to their own country's minimum size.

There is another thread on here damning tiny cages! Plenty of people posting on that and all in agreement - highlighting the most ridiculously small cages.

[LunaTheHamster1]

Originally Posted by hammies3

I mostly disagree. They mean well, and hamsters deserve more than the absolute bare minimum. I looked up your cage, and in Germany it’s actually considered too small. The rescue I have been in contact with wouldn’t adopt put a hamster to someone with a cage that size. And that’s because it is too small for a Syrian especially. I had one that was of a similar size for a Robo before I upgraded to a larger £30 tub cage and she uses a absolutely every inch in her enclosure except now she can’t bite the bars. I felt like I was doing something wrong when I realised I needed to upgrade, but I got over it because it’s not about me, it’s about the living being that only lives 2 years, so why not make it a good 2 years?

I don’t have a natural set up, I make my hides from cardboard and toilet paper tubes. Space is key.

Lets Talk About Hamster Cages � - YouTube This video explains it all, with the studies linked.

Hamster welfare is number one, I try my best to save money where I can but the bedding really is a huge cost if you’re giving them the minimum 5/6 inches. People should know that and be under no illusions about the cost involved. There are plenty of people giving advice on cheaper set ups, I think the bigger problem we should be talking about is why the bare minimum is seen as a high standard of care because it really isn’t.

Thanks for your thoughts and sharing your experience with your hamster.

Yes, the person probably did mean well, I just found the way she went about it rather patronising. She quoted cage sizes at me, then when she saw one of my cages was bigger than that, she still told me that my cages weren't big enough for any hamster. She also presumed I knew nothing about hamsters natural instincts, i.e. running for miles at night and burrowing.

I 100% agree that hamster welfare is no.1 and my pride shouldn't stand in the way of someone trying to help me and my hamsters. I think I am pretty open to help and advice, otherwise I wouldn't be on here. Lots of people have helped me in the past, on here, youtube and on IG.

Neither of my hamsters show stress symptoms, if they did I would do something about it. I also consider my care well above the minimum. Hamster care is not just about cage size.

I believe the Marrakesh cage is 96cm x 47cm, so only a few cms smaller on either sides than the Germany minimum of 100 x 50cm.

I have watched that video you mention in the past and I think my cages are around 699sq inches for my robo and 905sq inches for my syrian. These are the external measurements so internally may be a bit smaller.

Both my cages are bigger than what the rescue I adopt from recommend, which is 80 x 50cm. Every rescue, every country is different. It doesn’t stop me from striving to always learn and improve my hamster care where/when I can.

My original plan was to put 2 Marrakesh cages together and 2 Living World Eco habitat cages together, but due to Covid and Brexit I have not moved yet and those cages are no longer available in this country. So at some point I will come up with a plan B, which will work for me and my hamsters; financially, my health and the space I have. I also believe my robo would not be happy in a bigger space, so you have to take into account the individual hamsters needs too.

Regardless of all that I want to do in the future, I still think my hamsters have a pretty good life in either of those cages, as do plenty of others in the hamster community. Lots of people have happy hamsters in those cages. I think there is a huge difference between a hamster having a life in one of these cages compared to the many cages that aren’t even 450 sq inches and live in squalor, which is pretty much where all my hamsters started their lives before they were rescued.

You mentioned the height of bedding, this is yet another example of where peoples beliefs/opinions differ. Did you know the 5-6 inches min is different to some areas/countries where they quote 10-11 inches as a min, and even then the research shows some hamsters may not be happy until they have 80cm of bedding which is 31.5 inches.

I agree with what you said, the discussion should be more around why ‘the bare minimum is seen as a high standard of care because it really isn’t.’ But then as we have both just shown in our posts, bare minimum differs from country to country, people to people. I strongly believe that my hamsters care is well above the bare minimum, both by what I see others doing (good and bad) and how my hamsters react and live in my care.

[LunaTheHamster1]

Originally Posted by LunaTheHamster1

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So to sum up I personally don't feel peer pressure, I do what I want but i know and have seen cases of it.

Turns out I lied

This is still true, I don't feel peer pressure as such, as I know my hamsters have a good life with what I provide and do for them. However, I had realised I can beat myself up a little when I see these awesome, massive cages, You know like 2 metres plus, where the environment is absolutely awesome for that hamster. That's great for them and kudos to those that have the space, finances and health to do that, but I simply don't. This doesn't make me or other hamster owners in similar situations bad hamster owners.

I wrote a post about this on my IG the other day and I was blown away by the response it got, so many people contacted me and said they felt the same too and was glad I had brought it up. It's made me think I will do more about this subject and maybe tie it in with a video at some point.