Worried About Barnaby and Troy - Fighting Alot.

**Hope** · 11-10-2010, 02:28 AM

Barnaby and Troy have always been a little 'fiesty' with each other, but over the past week or so the fighting seems to have got worse and become more of a regular thing. Up till now it has just been the odd box, or the odd bum or belly bite. 2 or 3 weeks ago they did have a fairly big fight that went on for a while, and looked pretty serious but then things calmed down, I didnt see any fighting at all for several days after that, but now things seem to be getting worse, not better.

There are no injuries, no blood, no scars or anything but I cant help but worry if they are both happy together. Some of the behaviour that I have seen is a lot of chasing, Troy will chase Barnaby round and round and round the cage, snapping at his bum, untill Barnaby shoots off into a bed. Then Troy will wait, and then all of a sudden pounce into the bed and the fighting, squeeking and wrestling continues. Often Barnaby will be minding his own business and Troy will be almost stalking him like a cat, (I can almost see his little mind working, waiting to attack ljust like my cat does with a bird!) Then all of a sudden will pounce on him and wrestle with him. There is also a lot of bum biting, and belly biting. Sometimes they will sort of be holding on to each other with their mouths, untill one moves, and then its fight on again! Also if Barnaby is sat eating a peice of food (I scatter food, so it is all over) Troy will westle him for it, once he has gained the peice of food from Barnaby, he will just drop it, its not even like he wanted it, its like he just wats to be a pain to his brother! I often see Barnaby hiding behind things, and Troy will be out and about in the wheel, on the climbing frame etc. If Troy comes near him he will jump, and run away from him. He does seem to be frightened of him. The individual incidents do not last long, but its the frequency that is worrying me. For example in the 30 minutes that I sat watching them for last night, they had about 10 scraps. I am worried that it is becomming stressful for them and that Barnaby is living in constant fear of Troy. And Troys is feeling like he has to fight all the time. I feel like I am just waiting for the one scratch or bite that draws blood so that I can seperate them. I thought perhaps that it may be just a phase, or one was in a bit of a chasing mood, but their behaviour has been like this now for several days, and I am begining to worry.

I have really tired to do everything right for them, when I clean them out, they get 50% of the substrate back with the new, the toys and the beds are the same. I mix some old bedding in with the new, and mix it between the two beds, I scatter food, I have moved the wheels from being next to each other, as even though each is happy to wheel in its own wheel, Troy just likes to push Barnaby out. So Barnaby will go to the other wheel, but then Troy will leap out of the one he has just commendered and push Barnaby out of that one and so it goes on! They have two sand baths as they were fighting over the one they had, when I handle them I make sure that I get both of them out so one doesnt feel left out and they both have my scent, when I give mealworms I make sure that they both get some. I just dont know what else I can do for them! I want them to live together, and I dont want to have to seperate them, but if it is going to be better for them in the long run then thats what I will do.

Perhaps I am just being an over cautious mum, and worrying too much, and this is all normal brotherly behavoiur, but if they would be happier on their own then I am willing to seperate. Any help or advice would be very much appreciated.

souffle · 11-10-2010, 03:28 AM

It may be an idea to PM moderator Tammy22 Hope as she is very experienced on robos.
It does sound as if one is bullying the other rather too much and making his life a bit stressful. Our WW were like this when they reached maturity and we left it too late as blood was drawn in the end, Is there any noticeable size difference that might indicate one is not getting enough food due to the bully?

**Hope** · 11-10-2010, 03:42 AM

Thanks Souffle, I will PM Tammy, and she what she thinks. I will also PM Internet Nobody too.

No there is no size difference, or very little, but Barnaby does seem to have suffed pouches all the time, which I have read can indicate that one is keeping the other from getting food? Its a very stranage dynamic that they have, as Barnaby is actually the friendlier one!! He will sit on my hand, and is a lot slower and clamer when I handle him than Troy. Troy seems to be skittish and more fiesty. I just dont want it to get to the stage where they injure each other, not if I can help it.

Thanks for your help.

**Pompompoms** · 11-10-2010, 05:35 AM

Hi hope,

Have they just reached maturity? My two were absolutely fine untill they did, then it all kicked off! It does sound very similar. It sounds like you have done everything you can to help them live happily together in peace, and that's all you can do. Tammy is fantastic with Robo advice, I echo Souffles advice to drop her a line. With mine there was blood after a week, so it was a simple choice in the end.

I have read on here a couple of times that if you do everything right, you won't need to seperate robos. Please take it from me, this isn't true. I only wanted to draw attention to this, so that if you do in the end have no choice but to seperate, you don't feel bad at all. Better two healthy seperate robos that one injured or dead one. It sounds like you've done everything you can so far, and I'm sure Tammy will help you through the reintroduction method if it comes to that too. With mine nothing was going to stop The Cloud attacking Jam in the end, that's just the way he is so mine were permenantly seperated.

Good luck, it sounds like you're doing a great job! Please feel free to PM if I can help at all

Amethyst_ice · 11-10-2010, 05:48 AM

Aww sweetie..sounds bit hectic..little meanie. I have no experience with robos but hope it gets sorted soon xxxx

annie81 · 11-10-2010, 06:56 AM

tammy22 really helped me a lot with my fighting robos...definitely get in touch with her

i totally agree with pompompoms. it mostly depends on the character of the two robos you have if they will be happy together for their life or if they need to be separated. of course there are certain things you should or should not do when you have a pair to increase the chance that they will be fine together. but if one of them just likes to bully or fight all the time they still need separating.

its really weird that your robos show the same behaviour as mine. my robo holmes who is the dominant one and always started fights und bullying is, as you described, the calmer one when i handle them...just more relaxed. whereas dr watson, the bullied hamster, is more nervous. i actually had the impression very often that it was watsons nervousness that made holmes start the fights. holmes just wanted to cuddle up with watson but watson was scared and nervous and jumped and then holmes went after him.

...erm yeah...sorry for talking so much about my hammies in your thread

hope you get some help soon...

**Hope** · 11-10-2010, 07:26 AM

Thank you all very much.

I have been in contact with tammy22 and she has advised to do a full clean out and give fresh bedding, fresh substrate, and just water and food. Nothing else in the cage at all. So I will give that a go and see what happens. I am going to keep a close eye on them though, as I am worried that poor Barnaby wont have anywhere to hide from Troy anymore to defuse the fights. But I have everything crossed and will keep you all updated, (more for my own sanity than anything else! I have been worried sick! Even dreaming about comming home to a hammy blood bath

)

Pompompoms, They are about 13 weeks old I think, I got them on the 12th October and they were about 8-9 weeks old then I think. Thanks for what you said. I cant help feeling like I have failed these little guys, especially when I have tired to do everything by the book. What you said makes sense though - all hammies are individual and its not going to work in a 100% of cases. I would definately rather seperate (I have the sapre cage constantly set up!) than have one injured or worse. - thanks for your kind words!

Annie- No worries!

Its good to hear otehr peoples experiences, it really helps. Glad that my two are not the only little werdios!!

Are Holmes and Watson still together?

annie81 · 11-10-2010, 09:24 AM

they are still together...but only just. i have the spare cage set up ready for use. i havent separated them yet because they are still mainly sitting next to each other eating and running in a wheel each, sitting on top of each other....its just sometimes something kicks off and then i am actually going to the cage ready to get one of them out and then...nothing...sitting next to each other again...happy as larry. they are 5 months old now btw

fluffymunchkins · 11-10-2010, 11:41 AM

Best of luck

I was very lucky with Peggy and Dot, no matter how often they squabbled they were always like two peas in a pod by the end of the day.

Teddy · 11-10-2010, 12:19 PM

aww, good luck with the boys. My two were the same but it was the smaller, bullied one (Hugo) that is calm one when I hold him and the dominant one (Herman) was skitty and insecure. His insecurity and dominant tendencies made him attack Hugo just for being around ... They slept together like two little angels but when out at night Herman would just batter little Hugo at every opportunity. When Hugo got a scratch on his nose and started to look a little scruffy, I seperated ... it wasn't worth the possibility of loosing Hugo. As it turned out, Herman died a week or so later unexpectedly. What I was planning to do was do a split tank to re-introduce them. Maybe you could try that??