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Old 12-08-2015, 08:56 AM   #1
vidasmile
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Default Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

Hello, I am a beginner hobby breeder. 4 months earlier we had our first litter. One hamster is very interesting for me. I guess he is Dark grey Umbrous (dgdg U-) or Cream Umbrous (ee U-). I just can not understand how can he be umbrous if his mother is Golden banded and father is black banded (umbrous gene is dominant).
I put the photos of a hamster and the litter.
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File Type: jpg DSC00472.jpg (82.8 KB, 39 views)
File Type: jpg DSC00471.jpg (88.9 KB, 28 views)
File Type: jpg DSC00469.jpg (81.7 KB, 43 views)
File Type: jpg Pirmoji vada.jpg (20.4 KB, 40 views)
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Old 12-08-2015, 09:11 AM   #2
Jenibelle
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

I can't help with genetics at all, but that is one stunning boy!
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Old 12-08-2015, 09:39 AM   #3
vidasmile
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

Thanks
I will forward your words to my friend in whose home he is living
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Old 12-08-2015, 09:42 AM   #4
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

I don't have a clue about genetics either but have to say that he really is so beautiful, gorgeous little guy!
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Old 12-08-2015, 02:16 PM   #5
Hekomi
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

Cream umbrous would be sable. He doesn't look umbrous to me - that would turn the cheek flashes grey.

My first thought would be silver grey though silver grey would show either as silver grey on the mother or dingy black on the father. What continent are you in? Dark grey is recessive so could be carried - would mean both mum and dad carry. Do you have a pedigree back any further?
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Old 12-08-2015, 02:45 PM   #6
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

either colour he is still gorgeous sorry I know am not of any help but just needed to comment as he reminds me of my little hammy called harry (past hamster) I held his paw until he crossed rainbow bridge which I felt very upset about but I love the colour! always wanted to know what it was called xx
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Old 12-08-2015, 11:14 PM   #7
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

He is Hetero Silver gray in my opinion. Who determined he was Dark grey?
With Mom being a Golden the Sg(which is Dominant) would have to be from the Black Band Sire. Dingy Black AKA Silver Black is only obvious when the hamster is young and has it's baby fur. When the adult fur comes in they look exactly like a Black hamster UNLESS it is a Homozygous Silver grey's offspring then the adult coat tends to keep a bit of the silvery tint to the black coat.
Here is a Homo Silver grey's Silver Black band son
Winthrop-9-3-10-a.JPG
Here is his Hetero Silver Black band daughter before shedding out her baby coat
Lalita-a.JPG
and the same Silver black band girl at almost 1 1/2 years old
Lalita-9-4-11-c.JPG
This was Lilita's Dam Hadiya who was a Rex Umbrous Golden who had a 6 generation pedigree of both Sire and Dam and who had no Silver grey in her pedigree.
Hadiya-5-23-10-a.JPG
As you can see Winthrop never lost his silvery tint in his coat where his daughter was silvery as a youngster but as black as a normal Black Band as an older adult.

Here is Lilita's only litter at 19 days old the Sire was a Normal Golden carrying Black who may have carried Rex coat but proved he didn't.
The Xanlitas-day 19-zH.JPG
However it did prove Lilita was a hetero silver black band with the 2 Silver Grey pups
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Old 12-09-2015, 12:49 AM   #8
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U? Help needed!

Thank you, dear Hekomi and Nancy, for the answer. I will try to make some photos of a father (don't want to use flash, so need to catch daylight during daytime). Maybe he is not black, but Silver grey? Actually when he was young he looked darker and he lightened when his long fur grow up (not darkened).
I do not have pedigree documents for these hamsters, because there is not such a thing in Lithuania (where I live).
And about dark grey - I assumed that it is the only recesive gene for grey, so I assumed that from golden mom and black father there is the only option.
Or is it possible to have Sg and aa, and to look as black?

Last edited by vidasmile; 12-09-2015 at 04:45 AM.
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Old 12-09-2015, 03:16 AM   #9
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U?

There are the pictures of the father. I thought he is black banded long haired (aa Baba ll). Can he be Silver Black banded longhaired (Sg- aa Baba ll)?
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File Type: jpg DSC00475.jpg (89.5 KB, 15 views)
File Type: jpg DSC00507.jpg (91.1 KB, 15 views)
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Old 12-09-2015, 03:56 AM   #10
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Default Re: Dark Grey U or Cream U?

If some grey colour could go with the black, maybe then Trintukas (its a name of a hamster. Means "Eraser") has light grey gene not silver grey.
I found such an information about grey alleles:
Light Grey Lglg Buttermilk grey with heavy dark grey ticking
Silver Grey SgSg Soft pastel grey lightly ticked with brownish black
Dark Grey dgdg Pearly grey with heavy black ticking and black eye rings
I am not a native English speaker, so maybe I understand something wrong. But what I found in google "buttermilk color" is much more about his color, than "pastel grey". And he definately has ticking (I thought is umbrous). But maybe it is just Light grey (Lglg)?
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File Type: jpg DSC00469.jpg (81.7 KB, 5 views)
File Type: jpg color-buttermilk.jpg (11.3 KB, 2 views)
File Type: jpg soft grey tones.jpg (24.3 KB, 6 views)

Last edited by vidasmile; 12-09-2015 at 04:40 AM.
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