New Mating Diary!

[Holly]

Well hopefully anyway!

I know I love reading about other people's litters and I plan to do a diary on my website about my forthcoming (hopefully!) litter - I thought I'd post it here as well if no one objects - Gill and Teresa do you fancy doing the same for yours? We won't be able to post early pics here (forum rules) but we can discuss progress and post pictures later on. We can also ask questions of the more experienced breeders!

Tonight's the night for Smartie and Toblerone (I hope). Smartie has consistently stood every fourth night for the past 12 nights so I'm hopeful.

Smartie is a LH Satin BEC bred by Chocolate Hams (me and Will!). Her parents are our Caramel (Tristar) and Paws (Custard Hamstery). As Smartie has Cinnamon/REC on both sides of her ancestry I'm hoping she carries REC!

Smartie is a bit mischevious at times (bar chewing etc!) but she has a lovely temperament and, though she's still very young for a show Cream, she's won two 3rds in LH Satin out of her first three shows (and come well up the table in the one she wasn't placed in) which is wonderful! She's a good size (180g at five months) and should get bigger during and after her pregnancy!

Smartie:
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6082.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6081.jpg

(These are both when she was young - will edit with new pics tonight).

<Edit> Here's Smarts as she is now - infortunately I put too much olive oil on her wheel spindle yesterday so she's got a greasy mohican :oops: ):

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6613.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6620.jpg

Toby (Toblerone) is a LH Mink who comes from Bourne Valley, his parents were a REC LH and a Sable-Roan LH. He is one of the most laid back hamsters I've ever met (though he's recently discovered slightly obsessive wheel running :? ). Toby is also still pretty young and he's a good weight for a male (184g at nearly five months - though he was up to 190g before he discoverd the wheel). As he's a Mink he is shown in Non-Standard and he's been placed in all 3 of his shows so far - a 2nd, 3rd and 4th! We have high hopes for Tobes when he's a bit older!

Toby:

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6166.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6272.jpg

(Again these are baby pics really - will edit later)

<Edit: Updated with pics of the grown up Toby:

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6639.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6640.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6634.jpg


I'll update tonight if I think The Smarterones have been conceieved! As with all litters I can't be sure what colours we'll get - definitely BEC's and Sables, hopefully REC's and Minks, some Satin and all LH!

I hope everyone thinks this is a good idea and that Gill and Teresa will join in - hope I haven't chanced fate posting this :shock:

[Bunsey]

i think it's a great idea!! i'll post one when i've got a girlfriend for oscar and she's old enough etc. :D
we are going with a LH BEC. we've decided to have an all LH litter, rather than a SH carrying LH... mainly because mum wants all LH "cuddly teddies" as she calls them :lol: We would also consider a satin ourselves.

[Spuds Mum]

You can definitely count me in Julie - I will do a proper post of introducing Bronte & Grey-ham later this evening!

OOOO so excited to have another diary I loved the last one so so much! :x

[Holly]

Brilliant!

I'm so nervous about tonight - I don't know why, last time I had a male who wasn't even mine to keep safe, the lovely Paws! Smartie's been up since 3 pm going nuts on her wheel and trying to monkey bar the log bridges - I'm sure tonight is her night!!!!!!!!!!! :oops:

[Basia]

Me too :D
I plan to mate my home-bred, Hedgehog lines, (apparently satin) LH sable, Truffle with Balou, LH Cream from Tristar.
When and if she 'stands' :roll:

[Matty Day]

you can count me in to although i might be tempted to start a new one considering it will be the forums first Chinese mating diary :x

[Mollz]

Ohh yay - can't wait to hear how everything goes and hopefully hear about a baby that will hopefully be mine. Let's hope you end up with enough little boys!
You can guarantee that I will be glued to this thread and of course the other breeding diaries.
Good luck with the mating and let us know how it goes. I hope they get along and Tobes is ok (I'm sure everything will be fine :wink: ).

[Bunsey]

good luck with the mating! i can't wait to hear how it went! i'd be worried if i had a female that didn't stand, like Hannah doesn't. she stinks 3 nights out of 4, so maybe the night she deosn't stink she's in heat! :? I hope the girl i want to mate stands easily for me!

[souffle]

Dear Smartie,
This is all getting to much for you poor old dad. I am too young to be a grandad to 40 babies. Luckily you have your mother close at hand to advise. Yet again your husband to be has not asked for your fair paw in marriage. These modern hamsters have no respect. Still at least you told me Smartie unlike that hussy of a sister of yours Brontosarous. Enjoy yourself but don't forget your father warned you.
Your loving father
Paws

[Spuds Mum]

Message from a repentant Bronte to Paws

Aww Daaad! don't blame me, blame Mum for making us all independent modern girls! Anyway, I have sent you a photo of us at the altar - we got married at the Church of the Modern Day Gabber, and look how serious we were when we took our vows!

http://www.madabouthamsters.com/images/misc/hamsters_bronte_greyham_001.jpg

Hope you can see what a nice boy he is, and love you loads!
Always your girl,
Bronte xx

Message to Smartie from Bronte



Hey sis! I hear you are going to tie the knot tonight, so just wishing you well! Getting married is fantastic and me and my man had a fantastic night! :wink: :wink: some of the photos I can't show you, but here is me with my new man, look how he is whispering sweet nothings in my ear! :x I feel a bit different now, and think I may be expecting, how exciting if we had our families at the same time! And I hear Poly has decided to settle down too, and is looking for the right woman - aren't we all 'growed up'!

http://www.madabouthamsters.com/images/misc/hamsters_bronte_greyham_002.jpg

Hope your night goes as well as mine did on Friday! I'm sure it will, I hear your new man Toby is a bit of a babe!
cogratulations and Luv ya!
Bronte x x

[Spuds Mum]

Message from a repentant Teresa....

Okay, I will stop it now! Well as you can see we mated our BEC SH beauty Bronte to our dark-grey SH boy Grey-ham on Friday night. Things seemed to go well and pups should be expected on 9th March. we would expect a litter of goldens carrying cream and dark grey, although it is possible as both could be carrying cinnamon, that a cinnamon pup will also appear!

I'm a bit worried as, unless my eyes are deceiving me, Bronte's tummy already has a little more of a bulge and it is normal to not notice any difference until about day 10 of pregnancy (maybe she just ate too much wedding cake!)

[Holly]

Ha! I can't get Smartie to reply to either her dad or sis at the moment - she's been a little bit ...er...busy :wink:

I think it went ok and I think *touch wood* we may well be hearing the patter of tiddy widdy feet soon :)

I was going to take pics of the actual mating but couldn't quite bring myself to - luckily, Teresa, you've done it for us all :P

Bronte looks MASSIVE compared to Grey-Ham :shock:

[Spuds Mum]

Yes she is bless her, 196g when I weighed her a couple of nights ago - I worried about Grey-ham being a bit small but apparently dark greys tend to be small and take longer to grow - Sheryl was optimistic he would reach a normal size eventually!He was 134g on 5th Feb, should weigh him again soon!

Glad everything went okay with Smartie and Toby, hopefully that pitter patter of feet will be heard in both our houses (and of course Gill's and Matty's shortly).

[Holly]

I'm keeping everything crossed for us all!

It's kind of nice having others going through it too (hark at me anyone would think it was me having the babies :oops: ).

[Mollz]

Congratulations to all the sets of humans and hamsters involved in the various matings. I'm keeping everything crossed for all of you :wink:

Now everyone else has also got to start their own diaries!

[souffle]

Bronte
Arrrrrrgh....that is it. I officially disown you. What do you think this is 'Playham' I never though I'd see it. A daughter of mine flaunting herself in public.
Your ex father
Paws

[Spuds Mum]

Bronte is in tears, and it is not good for her in her condition, so i thought I would make a plea to Paws on his daughter's behalf.

I'm very sorry for taking the photo, but wish to stress that this is not an actual 'playham' photo, this was a courting photo, with Grey-ham just telling Bronte how much he loved her, rather than being a 'honeymoon' photo in the truest sense. Caramel brought Bronte up better than that!

Bronte has made me delete some of the photos as she said these were 'inappropriate' and 'made her look like she had a double chin'. So apologies to Paws again.

:wink: :D

[souffle]

Hmmmmph...I will think about it
Sulky dad
Paws

[Basia]

Are we all supposed to make our own diary or is it going to be a giant joint effort like last time?
I mated Truffle & Balou last night so if we get babies they will be born the same day as Holly's. :D
I did take some photos I was thinking of using for my website but my youngest son (Catholic School educated) saw them and told me I need to say some 'Hail Mary's' for taking photos like that. :oops:

[souffle]

I think they should have one each ladies. It may be the case that the forum will change over then it would be very hard to keep up to date with a HUUUUUGE thread from this one...and of course they each deserve a unique one. So Basia is it the Truffou's or the Baffles or Buffles :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Basia]

Souffle, you are so clever. Truffou's I think. :D
I will start my diary when (or if) we get pinkies then. We may already be on the new forum by then maybe?

[Yaffle]

How exciting for you all to be having litters (fingers crossed) at the same time! You'll all be making me hamster broody! Yeti's litter are all grown up now (5 weeks - it happens so quickly) and are all about ready to fly the nest :( I'll miss them lots!
I'll be on the look out for a female golden girlfriend for Snarf who I'm keeping from Yeti's litter so hopefully one of you may be able to help me out :P

[Basia]

I'll be on the look out for a female golden girlfriend for Snarf who I'm keeping from Yeti's litter so hopefully one of you may be able to help me out :P

I'm planning to mate my goldens in April. :wink:

[Matty Day]

I think they should have one each ladies

it should be ladies and gentlemen :x

as we are not all of the fair sex on this forum

anyway good luck to everyone and lets hope we all get good litters :wink:

[souffle]

Oooops sorry Matty...ladies and gentlemen :oops:

[Holly]

Are we all supposed to make our own diary or is it going to be a giant joint effort like last time?
I mated Truffle & Balou last night so if we get babies they will be born the same day as Holly's. :D


I sort of thought we might all use the same one as there'll likely be a lot of "well mine are doing such and such are yours?" posts - but souffle's right it will get a bit unwieldy like that :?

I did also think about waiting til the forum changeover to start it.....

[Basia]

I liked the joint one last time too.

[Catja]

Ooooh, this is all so exciting, can't wait to read all the posts. Echoing everything you were saying Mollz :lol:

Hope there is loads on the sale table on Saturday, loads to buy for the new additions :lol:

[souffle]

I don't mind folks, go with the most popular choice. :lol: :lol:

[Holly]

With all my worry about Harry I haven't posted on here.

Quick update - Smartie is now on Day 4 (hopefully!) of her pregnancy. She is behaving a little differently in that she's sleeping more. When she is awake she's super lively and has trashed her cage once - as well as found a way round one of her log bridges to swing and chew the roof bars :roll:

[Spuds Mum]

that sounds promising Julie! Glad Smartie seems to be doing well.

Bronte is on day 8 now and since early on has had a firm little tummy, that we noticed almost immediately but it hasnt grown a lot recently. She is also sleeping more. When awake she is still as lively and friendly as ever, but did have a bit of a hissy fit at about day four and trashed her cage so badly we had to take the gabber shelf out as she just went mad for chewing it - something she has never done before!

She has now started chewing at the place where the gabber clips go - so if she doesn't behave she will be in one of the tubs in a day or so! :x

[Mollz]

Everything seems to be going well for you both (and of course Smartie and Bronte). Can't wait to hear more.

Spud's mum - I swear you are going to have 20 or something if her belly is that firm and noticable :shock: :x

How is it going for you Gill?

[Spuds Mum]

I hope not lol!!! It isn't huge, although it was early on. It just seemed really firm from the start.

I've been fooled before though! although, she does seem to be showing signs of being an expectant Mum (although I hope of only about 10 max, not 20!!!!)

[Matty Day]

just thought id let you know im starting mating on sundays as louis has settled down quite well :x

i thinks thats athenas night but i just cant be sure if not i shall try 6 nights (under alexs advice) chinese cycles can be a bit funny thougth so hopefully the deed will be done quite soon :x

[Basia]

How is it going for you Gill?

Its hard to say Molz, Truffle has taken to her bed. She has been very quiet since I mated her and doesn't want to come out. I've got my fingers crossed that this is a positive sign. :)

Matty - If Sunday is the night - Good Luck.

[Holly]

Yes, good luck, Matty :)

Smarts isn't standing tonight, good news I guess. She's very quiet too Gill, let's hope that's a good sign in both cases. (I can't believe little Bronte's gonna be a mummy so soon :wink: ).

[Matty Day]

can anyone give me some general tips on how to tell if Athena will stand as I am trying to avoid any injury’s if I can I am after general tips even if they are aimed at Syrians as im mating them in the same way

I am starting to get nervous even now
i must it must have been the same for you guys first time

[Basia]

And the 2nd time. :wink:
I don't know anything about chinese, Matty. Do they 'stand' like syrian girls?
I usually handle one of the boys and then pick up the girl I am hoping is on heat. If she is she will usually freeze as soon as she smells the boy on me and I stroke her back. Sometimes they 'sort of stand' but are a bit restless. Usually they will stand properly later in the evening. I let my girls run around in their balls at the same time as the boys and they will often stand as soon as I get them out of the ball.
I mate them in a neutral cage, usually a spare Rody with some bedding so they don't slip. I watch them closely and will move the male around the right way if necessary. Didn't need to with Chunky, but had to lift Balou several times, poor Balou is a bit of a numbskull I think. I don't bother with gloves but do have a stiff bit of cardboard to put in between them if necessary and a small plastic container to scoop one up with in an emergency. On both occasions I have removed the male first.
Not sure if that will help you with your Chinese Matty.

[Matty Day]

thanks ill try and get in contact with alex ive got a copy of his article as i got given the lasttwo journels at highworth it just not detailed enougth i better get some new balls tommorow i did had a couple but sat on them :(

what time would you try for a syrian
just after as many tips ideas as i can

[Matty Day]

also wake up a female or would you wait for her to wake up :?:

sorry im asking so many qustoins i just dont want either of them getting hurt

[souffle]

I would wait for her to wake Matty. Our female syrians usually stand around 7.30pm earliest and 11pm latest. You could let Louis in a ball first then put Athena in the same ball so she smells him and see how she responds. I don't know if Chinese stand like Syrians either but I suspect them are more like WW or Campbells which just trundle after each other then have a quick mate. You could let them meet through a wire mesh then gradually lift it to see how it goes. All the best for the time and as long as you are prepared for anything with cardboard and I would suggest a water pistol which you can squirt them with just enough to startle if they fight then just get them apart.

[Matty Day]

Right just thought id fill you in on tonight’s proceedings. So far I have moved Louis cage into my room permanently were me and the girls live I’m waiting for Athena to get up then I will get Louis up and I will give it a go from there

Hopefully the deed will be done and we can go from there and ill have some nice play ham pics to :x

[Matty Day]

bad news she attacked him as soon as i let them togther however he was trying to lick/bite her bum could she have been on heat and just not wanted to mate?

what do you guys think ill try until the end of the week

or i might switch and use aprodite instead if she doesn't accept him by then

[souffle]

It may have just been too early matty. They will only accept the male when fully in ovulation. She needs to get to know him a bit I think. Try putting her in his cage so she get the scent of him then letting them meet through a wire mesh. I have seen a syrian not stand then two hours later a successful mating. It is as tight as that. The females are only fertile for a couple of hours. Don't be disheartened as it takes some time and needs some patience. We find males will lick at the females whether they are in season or not so don't go by that sign. I would try again this evening and repeat every evening till they pair. Keep him beside her so she gets the scent of him and I am sure she will accept.

[Matty Day]

right ive rejiged the cages like you have adviced me to

but im not going to try again tonight as they boath bit each other but not to badly so im going to try again tommorrow :x

so would you say it would be a good idea to try at 7.30 then 9.30

hopefully evrything should go ok next time

just out of intrest what should they do througth the mesh should she stand for him

[souffle]

Through the mesh they should just sniff each other and see if she shows any interest. I am not sure how Chinese react as I have never bred them and I doubt they are like syrians. Have you tried to contact Alex? I would try with a syrian every hour. Sometimes they will even go a bit strange and mate during the day. Have another check of Alex's article and see if you have any hints there. It may be that you need to take a different approach such as letting them stay together but still it is very early days with only one attempt. You do not want them hurting each other though so take care. Did Athena go for Louis or were both wary?

[Matty Day]

Athena went for Louis he was just trying to lick/bite her bum so maybe they boath went for each other

I have got a copy of alexs article and it seems reasonably helpful

I will try and contact Alex and I will put a post over on the hamster forum as I know there are a few people on there with experience with Chinese breeding

I am just going to try tomorrow and i will try every day this week until I get a result

there cages are now right next to each other and as I share a room with my hamsters I can keep a close watch on them to see if they pay any attention to each other and so far I have seen Athena sniffing a lot

I will try each evening for the rest of the week and will try several times a night when she is up

[Holly]

I'm a little worried about Smartie.

Today is Day 6 of her pregnacncy (if she's pregnant). She's very quiet compared to her normal behaviour, not keen to come out much at all. What's bothering me is that she doesn't seem to be eating much. I've increased the amount of hamster mix she's getting slightly in the past 2 days and also starting giving her a little more high protein stuff (egg, rice pudding etc). She's not even eating as much as she'd normally eat as yet - is this something to worry about?

I remember Caramel really packing away the extra food from fairly early on.

[Basia]

I don't know Holly, everything seems something to worry about. I do remember that Berry didn't eat much, and none of the extra special bits I gave her, until she had actually had the babies a day or two. I was convinced that she wasn't pregnant.
Truffle isn't eating any extra at the moment and having been really quiet all week is now manically running on her wheel for the last 2 days. :?

[Matty Day]

right i shall try again tonight hopefully i will have some good news to report back then :lol:

thanks for all the tips im just hoping wi have some sucess tonight :x

i alway knew this would be the worst experience of breeding due to my inexpereince on the subject.

[souffle]

Does Smartie have any discharge or does she 'smell' any different Holly? Sometimes they can get a pyo from mating so that is something to watch very closely, however I think she is probably just brooding. I don't think they eat that much extra to be honest and I bet you are giving her loads extra so it looks as if she is not eating but in actual fact she is eating normally. All you can do is offer varied extras in the protein department and watch her closely preparing as normal for the pups. Ours never gain till the last few days which is why we always think they are not pregnant!

[Holly]

There's no discharge or odd smell as far as I can tell. She seems normal enough when she does come out, it's just that she's out a lot less than normal. Perhaps I am giving too much extra food for this early stage. I'll have a good look at her tonight if she wants out - thanks.

[Matty Day]

i think we have some good news there not mating but there playing with each other happily so i might be tempted to let them co habit for a while :x i think ill add all the extensoins to louis duna and go from there :x

[Matty Day]

i tryed but they fought as soon as they went in eithers cages togther i think that maybe it mght work and they might mate when i try at 9

[Mollz]

Julie: I'm sure everything is fine with Smartie, but it won't hurt to keep an eye on her.
I think that you could be over-compensating with the food a bit, giving the appearence of her not eating as much. Maybe you could try feeding her the normal amount of normal dried mix, and just extra proteins stuff so you can get a batter idea of whether she is eating as normal.
Keep us updated, my fingers are crossed for you and Smartie. - just in case.

Sounds good Matty, keep us posted

[Spuds Mum]

Good luck Matty!

I am also sure Smartie is okay Julie, Bronte has also been a lot quieter and spent more time sleeping. She is not eating noticeably more, although we are also supplementing her diet with protein. She is building up an impressive store though, and, something I have noticed a couple of my pregnant & nursing Mums do, is also storing food in her bowl - i.e. if I scatter food over the cage floor she picks it all up and puts it away in her bowl!

As I write she is on the shelf behind me having made a lovely huge nest (I daren't tell her she is going in a tub on Wednesday :? ) and , at day 10, has a nice little bump when she moves or stretches.

[Matty Day]

i am going to try at 8 and 10 as well hopefully if i try once an hour each dayfor a week i should get a result :x

anway if they dont mate tonight they know each other smell

[Matty Day]

right my last report of tonight no mating but when on nuetral territory they do not attack each other and louis try to lick athenas bum and ears and she moves away or dosent paya ttentoin to his advance is tonight just not her night as that is what i am thinking :x

[Spuds Mum]

I'm nop chinese expert Matty, but if she is not attacking him but they aren't mating it sounds like we have with Syrians when it is just a bit too early in the evening - girls have very short seasons in the winter months. A shame you couldnt try in another hour or so? :cry:

[Matty Day]

i will try i dont have to be in college til 10.25tommrow so ill try at ten an elven then leave it

ive also fired the heating up

[souffle]

Its not the heat matty it is the day length. You need to be patient. Sometimes cycles are irregular and often first matings are unsucessful. With Bailey we mated her and then she did not stand again for 10days. She was not pregnant but then on day 12 she mated again and had 8 pups. I think they just need time.

[Spuds Mum]

Its not the heat matty it is the day length. You need to be patient. Sometimes cycles are irregular and often first matings are unsucessful. I think they just need time.

I certainly had experience of that with trying to mate Vala and yowie, it was very frustrating and took lots of patience. I agree with Souff who knows much more than me! :D

[Matty Day]

blanked again im afraid they just sat in seprate corner of the mating pen and louis licked her a bit again one more chance then im going to have to go to bed i am afraid :cry:

i relay whish this was the holidays :evil: as i would have no problem staying up to 2 or three if needs be

im realy just hoping we get a postive result by friday as im going to stay with a friend and i would not like to assign the task to my new trainee
:(

[Matty Day]

good news he manged to mount athena four times so we might be due some pups in 21 days :x thougth it wasnt for very long it was over in 5 minutes so im not that sure but we shall try every night as planned

[Catja]

Fingers crossed for you Matty :lol:

[souffle]

Well at least you know she will accept him Matty. Five minutes is not long really but it may be long enough though with a syrian we usually leave them together for at least 20mins. Would she take him with her any longer? Keep her quiet now and feed her plenty protein to help he grow strong pups. Fingers are crossed now. :lol:

[Matty Day]

im going to leave her in with me for the rest of the week then i shall get the perfecto ready and move her in with my dad who dosent have the habit of falling to sleep with the tv on :x

[Spuds Mum]

Tonight (day 10) I have moved Bronte into one of our breeding tub cages.

I was going to just leave her in her Gabber, however for some reason she has suddenly started going mad gnawing on the bits of plastic that hold the clips, and is driving me insane with the constant grating sound (apart from ruining her gabber of course which is unthinkable). she has also started making nests in various corners and trying them out for the last day or two, and so I thought that if I were to move her then it would be better sooner rather than later. I was going to give her her final clean out on Thursday, but brought that forward by a day too.

So she is now in the 'maternity home' :shock: and is settling in nicely. I made her a nice nest in one corner and she has decided to spread all the bedding over the cage, but I am confident she will gather this all up later to make a comfy bed.
She is definitely expecting as she now has a very definite 'bump' which bulges to one side quite alarmingly when she moves in certain ways.

[Holly]

Oooh exciting, Teresa! It's very near now, can't wait to hear that Cazza is a granny and my lot are all Aunts and Uncles!

Nothing really to report with Smartie - she's put on 4g in a week so I'm hopeful!

[Mollz]

It seems that a fair few females start frantically chewing during pregnancy, I wonder why? At least she'll be able to get settled now Teresa.

she's put on 4g in a week so I'm hopeful!

Sounds good Julie! :D

[Matty Day]

athena has benn digging quite alot and has been asleep a long time as far as i know. I will defintly know if she is pregnant or not either on friday or tuesday. Depending if my night out on the town goes to plan on friday. :x

[Bunsey]

very exciting guys! :D

[Jane]

I love reading these! Really exciting :D

Makes me want more hammies though :cry: Therefore I bet my parents hate these threads :lol: :lol:

[Bunsey]

my dad doesn't even know :lol: :lol:

[Basia]

Truffle has been very quiet since her date with Balou, spending most of her time sleeping. Tonight she is out and about and I have had quite a shock. She is clearly pregnant and the babies are not due until next Wednesday. :shock:

[souffle]

Good news Basia and it looks like you are going to hear the patter of many tiny paws soon!! Glad to hear the others are all doing well too. :lol:

[Catja]

Truffle has been very quiet since her date with Balou, spending most of her time sleeping. Tonight she is out and about and I have had quite a shock. She is clearly pregnant and the babies are not due until next Wednesday. :shock:

Ooh, this is so exciting, can't wait :lol:

[Matty Day]

progrees report on athena she is now at day three if pregnant
she has been sleeping digging and she is now hoarding alot more food than usaul. :x

[Mollz]

Gill, can we put bets on how many there will be?
I guess....... 20! :wink: She must be having lots if you can see that she is pregnant already :D

Good luck everyone, and remember to keep us updated.

[Basia]

Gill, can we put bets on how many there will be?
I guess....... 20! :wink: She must be having lots if you can see that she is pregnant already :D

Good luck everyone, and remember to keep us updated.

Dear Lord Molz I hope you don't win the bet! The hamster I had years ago showed she was pregnant early on and she had 17. I hope Truffle doesn't have that many but I am guessing it could be in the teens because Berry didn't show at all until the last couple of days and she had 9.

[Matty Day]

im just glad that chinese can only realy have a maxium of 8 pups :x

[Holly]

]

Dear Lord Molz I hope you don't win the bet! The hamster I had years ago showed she was pregnant early on and she had 17. I hope Truffle doesn't have that many but I am guessing it could be in the teens because Berry didn't show at all until the last couple of days and she had 9.

Oopps!!!!

Well (thank goodness) Smartie doesn't seem to be showing as yet. She is a little bigger all over, I think, and definitely behaving in a pregnant (ie different to her normal) way - and she's put on some weight - so I'm still fairly sure she is pregnant. We may get a few less this time (11 last time) which is typical when I already have lovely homes for 7 :?

[Mollz]

Well (thank goodness) Smartie doesn't seem to be showing as yet. She is a little bigger all over, I think, and definitely behaving in a pregnant (ie different to her normal) way - and she's put on some weight - so I'm still fairly sure she is pregnant. We may get a few less this time (11 last time) which is typical when I already have lovely homes for 7 :?

I meant to say to you the other day Julie, if you don't have enough homes then let your other people be the priority - especially as I was probably the last to ask and have changed my mind on which sex I want as it is. I don't want to cause you a problem. I know you wanted to keep a few too.
You're expecting creams too aren't you Gill and Teresa? So don't panic, if she doesn't have enough then I could always have one of their's if it makes life easier for you...

I can't wait for all these babies to be born - It's going to be so exciting!

[Holly]

I'm sure there will be "enough" for the 7 we need, Mollz - and you were actually one of the first to ask me - only Catja, Will and myself were before you. Of the others one is for a girl on another forum who only wants a LH male anyway and the other two are for pet homes so friendliness and cuteness are their only requirements!

[Matty Day]

this is good news when are you planning to go ahead with the second litter Julie ?

ill be ready for the start of may but if you want to have to wait I don’t mind as long as I can bring him home by august I have no problems with this as it will give me time to rehome Louis and Athena’s litter if anyone is after a Chinese hamster they will be ready to rehome at north Somerset and will probably be on the sales table there thought I have found homes for two and I will be keeping the best boy as I am going to ask some of the more experienced Chinese breeders

[Spuds Mum]

Well Bronte is definitely nesting now, the unfortunate thing is that she has chosen to make a beautiful nest right next to the water bottle, which she has buried under the nest, causing it to empty and leave the bedding horribly damp!

So we are trying to encourage her to use one of the other corners!

She is due on Sunday and I'm sure it can't come soon enough for her as she is waddling around and has a huge bump. Here are some pics

http://www.madabouthamsters.com/images/misc/hamster_bronte_pregnant_001.jpg

http://www.madabouthamsters.com/images/misc/hamster_bronte_pregnant_002.jpg

http://www.madabouthamsters.com/images/misc/hamster_bronte_pregnant_003.jpg

[Mollz]

Wow Teresa - I wonder how many she is going to have, she's so huge!

:D How very exciting though, keep us updated :D

[Spuds Mum]

Wow Teresa - I wonder how many she is going to have, she's so huge!

:D How very exciting though, keep us updated :D


Heeelllpppp!!! :shock: Scary thing is those photos don't show how big she seems in real life! But I think probably between 11 and 13 (but that is because all of my Mums have given birth to either 11 or 13 pups, so I may be in for a shock!) :? :shock:

[Catja]

Ooh they are great photos, gives a really good idea of what a pregnant syrian looks like.

What colours are you hoping for?

[Spuds Mum]

they should be goldens carrying cream and dark grey Catja. Part of a longer term plan possibly if I get a really good girl or boy out of it! :D

[Basia]

Wow Teresa, she looks - pregnant!
She's a gorgeous colour too. Not long to wait now for you or Bronte. :D

[souffle]

Dear Bronte
It would appear that I am going to be a grandad. I am far to young to be a grandad and by the looks of things am going to be a great grandad as well! Please ensure Grayham works very hard as it looks like he has rather a lot of mouths to feed. In view of your size and circumstances I have decided to forgive you.
Your loving father
Paws

You can always rely on your dad! :lol:

[Catja]

Genetics is really interesting, if we were to breed from Desi who is golden but whose background we don't know, or Bonaparte who is cinnamon with a girl whose background we do know, that was cream or sable is there any idea what colours we would likely get?

[Basia]

Probably goldens but you never know what your boys are carrying so you could get some surprises. :)

[Holly]

Wow!! Brontosaurus you look HUGE!

Your sister is about 5 days behind you, I took a couple of piccies this morning, she's definitely getting a bit rounder but nothing like Bronts :shock:

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6655.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6659.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6661.jpg

[Matty Day]

well athena pregnat as i mated her on monday and she attacked louis when i put them togther on this friday night assuming ive calculated right :x

[Spuds Mum]

That's a good sign Matty, but not altogether foolproof, as our Vala tricked us with that one too! :oops:

But hopefully your Athena is less devious than Vala and you will have some lovely wriggly chinese ham babies shortly!

Julie - Smartie looks fantastic what a beautiful colour she has! And pregnancy obviously suits her fur! And all I can say is that a lot can happen in 5 days! :wink:

Letter from Bronte to her Dad Paws
Dear Daddy,
Thankyou for forgiving me and I hope we never fall out again. I am so happy that I am going to be having some children and have made sure that not only Grey-ham but my humans are pandering to my every desire (tonight my craving was cottage cheese with carrot sticks and broccoli and they brought it straight to me!) I think it may be that I am eating for twenty rather than that I am having twenty babies (well I hope so anyway). I am going to have to work hard at my postnatal exercises to get my figure back I think!! Give my love to Poly, Hope you are all well
Brontesaurus (and never was a name so apt as now!)

[Matty Day]

just did vala become a complete food adict as athena is building up one hell of a store and is digging crazy (even more than usaul) if not ill use athena or get louis a mistress.

[Spuds Mum]

Vala is my golden blob Matty and would eat for England if we let her, so of course we were fairly convinced first time that she was expecting as we were upping her protein etc. and it was all disappearing and the store was being kept nicely. Second time (when she attacked at the test mating) we were much more wary, and was not at all surprised when she didn't deliver. She was getting on a bit though Matty, and it doesn't mean that I think Athena will be the same.

It just pays to relax and let nature take its course - your Sire and Dam are both fit and healthy young things and I am sure babies will come along eventually. If not after this last mating, then next time you try! :D

Here's hoping you soon can report a chinese hamster that looks as though she has swallowed a ping pong ball! :x

[Matty Day]

im quite sure that monsiuer has worked his magic on madam :x

it was a shame about vala .

ive got alot of preperatoins to do this weekend luckliy i havent got to much work.
thougth i am considering that if monsiuer has a good show record as his dad he can also have many mistress as i might be tempted to loan him out as a stud.

[Spuds Mum]

Lucky Louis!! :wink:

[Holly]

Sounds good, Matty!

Smartie is curently going absolutely NUTS, she's wrecked the cage and is moving her nest to the front! I remember Caramel doing this but Smarts, so far, hadn't done it. She's literally throwing stuff around which makes a mockery of how I've tried to avoid handling her much and being really gentle with her - she could hurt herself if she's not careful :?

[Spuds Mum]

She wont hurt herself Julie, its those Carapaws genes coming out! :D she is just determined to get everything the way she wants it in time for the big day!

I love the personality the Carapaws all seem to have, they are so friendly but certainly seem to be full of confidence and very spunky!

[Matty Day]

im hoping my new syrain from you julie will display all theese cahrcteristics thougth i hop the bar chewing genes die out :x

[Holly]

im hoping my new syrain from you julie will display all theese cahrcteristics thougth i hop the bar chewing genes die out :x

Well Matty - Mars is a Carapaw baby and he doesn't bar chew at all........but Molly is a demon so I can't promise it won't get passed on via mum this time :wink:

Smartie's moved her nest back now - obviously she didn't like it there :shock: ...she's also knocked over her wheel, guess that makes it easier if she's done that when I need to take it out!

[Spacemonkey]

Bailey went loopy the last few days of her pregnancy forcing me to rapidly change her birthing cage at the last minute to avoid disaster. She was exactly the spitting image of Bronte and presented me with 10 so reckon young Bronte is heading for double figures at least.

GreyHam will have to get a job with Powergen, running on his wheel to create a few watts of electric, to pay for them all! :D

[Matty Day]

doesn't[/i] bar chew at all........but Molly is a demon so I can't promise it won't get passed on via mum this time :wink:

!

no problem good job im getting a rex of you to then as i can modify it to prevent chewing :x

[Spuds Mum]

Ahh Matty, yup you have my last litters chewing genes to blame for Molly I am afraid! :oops: In fact her sister, Amelie is behind me now chewing for her life. that said, you will Im sure have no problems with friendliness and cheekiness from her side. The litter that molly came from would literally crawl up my arms demanding attention and cuddles (and the two I have left still do!)

I'm excited you will hopefully be having a Carapawincessku baby! :D

[Matty Day]

update on athena i just weighed her she is ten grams heaveier than when i weighed her before highworth i will do a comparisoin to her sister so hopefully this is another good sign her abdomin wall has a tiny tiny bit of a bulge as i compared her to sis and hers is flater. :Dsee if anyone can make up a litter name fro louis and athena

[Spuds Mum]

Well I guess you could have the Athises, or the Lothenas? That sounds a good sign then Matty, looks like some are on the way!

I weighed Bronte today - she was 187g before the mating and today, the day before being due to give birth was....

......229g *gulp* :shock:

[Matty Day]

sounds like like a big litter to me
atenas bulge is not noticlble by eye but you can feel it when you you put you finger to it thougth

ive also borrowed some head phones so i can play loud music and computer games without bugging her. :x and ive med sure the tv volumes set low :x

[Basia]

I weighed Bronte today - she was 187g before the mating and today, the day before being due to give birth was....

......229g *gulp* :shock:[/quote]

Could be quite a few little Brontesauroses then! Can't wait for tomorrow, I need some happy news. :D

[Holly]

Whoa Teresa - there are going to be a few bambinos in there then :shock:

I weighed Smarts last night, she's put on 6g since before she was pregnant and 2g of that is since Wednesday so she's beginning to gain at last!

I'm sure there are less babies in her tum than in Bronte's though :shock:

[Spuds Mum]

I got some more photos and video of her tonight and she has grown even more - I'm seriously worried now about the number of pups she may have, and would be worried about PET (pre-eclampsia/toxaemia) if she didn't seem so well in herself.

All good thoughts for a safe delivery tomorrow/early hours of Monday please - I think gas and air and an epidural is in order (and thats just for me! :P ) will post the pics later, video will take a while longer Im afraid - we need some software for Arti's phone to transfer it!

[Basia]

I haven't weighed Truffle but she is enormous.
This is her just making sure she has enough to eat:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v296/gdb234/8308Truffle001.jpg

and this is the belly-bulge: :shock: She still has 3 days to go.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v296/gdb234/8308Truffle003.jpg

[Mollz]

Looks/sounds like big litters for Teresa and Gill then!

That is a huge weight gain from Bronte though :shock: :shock:

[Spuds Mum]

Letter from Bronte to Truffle

Dear Truffle,

I don't know about you but I feel the size of a cow! You look really well absolutely blooming. Have you got everything ready? I got the nursery just right, I even had the water bottle tucked away nice and neat under the bedding, and my blooming humans kept unmaking the nest! I've moved to another corner now in the hopes that they will now leave it alone!

Is it Wednesday that yours are due? It can't come quick enough for me. I'm practising my breathing exercises in preparation!

Take care
Bronte x

Letter from Teresa to Gill

Crikey Gill, looks like someone is going to produce a few Trufflets there!
Will keep you informed of Bronte's progress!
Teresa

[Basia]

Trufflets - that's a good one! Perhaps there are just a few big ones in there.
Good luck with Bronte, hope all goes well. Exciting now - final countdown!

Dear Bronte, Lucky you just one day to go.
I was happily living my life when my human introduced me to Balou and look at me now! You wouldn't think he had it in him, skinny little thing.
Good luck tomorrow - Wednesday can't come quick enough!
Love Truffle

[Spuds Mum]

Okay people, prepare yourselves for a shock.

Bronte with less than a day to go!

http://www.madabouthamsters.com/images/misc/hamster_bronte_pregnant_004.jpg

[Mollz]

Oh my goodness Teresa, she is HUUUUGE.
I almost had a heart attack when I saw her! What is she giving birth to - baby elephants?

[Basia]

Oh Teresa, she is huge, she must be carrying a lot of pups. These little males pack quite a punch don't they? I hope all goes well for her, she looks very fit and healthy.
She is going to be eating for england when she had delivered that bulge though.

[Matty Day]

bronte loosk like she has eaten cricket ball :shock: i think you may be in for twenty there :x

[Catja]

She really is big, grey-ham proves the old adage size isn't everything its what you do with it that counts :lol:

Baby trufflets I like that

[Holly]

Wow, Truffle looks like she's blooming!

I looked at a few books last night and they all shared the same consensus - if they look like beach balls on legs after about 10-12 days you are in for a mega big litter :P ....and they may not look much (or any!) different after 10-12 days (or even right up to the birth) if they are having 8 or less!

I still think (hope) Smarts is preggers - her behaviour has been very different and she's gained 6g in under a week after putting nothing at all for the past few weeks and even losing a gram or two. However there are such things as phantom pregnancies - I do hope she hasn't been fooling me all this time!

After it being so simple with Caramel (despite all my worrying) I guess I just thought it would be with Smartie as well. it would be ironic if she isn't pregnant at all.

Gill - don't they have four more days to go - aren't we expecting them Wednesday night? (I'm rubbish at maths :oops: ).

Teresa and Bronts - good luck for tonight - this is sooooo exciting!!!!!!!!!! :x

[jayne]

Wow!! Bronte is huge :P
I hope everything goes well when the time comes and look forward to hearing about the delightful babies!

Basia - Truffle is looking fab too! i must say, i love her colour, i could eat her :lol:

Good luck to all you pregnant hams out there and deep breaths for you all (including the mums to be!!!)

Sooooo exciting :P

[Basia]

I still think (hope) Smarts is preggers - her behaviour has been very different and she's gained 6g in under a week after putting nothing at all for the past few weeks and even losing a gram or two. However there are such things as phantom pregnancies - I do hope she hasn't been fooling me all this time!
I'm sure she is expecting, Holly. Just having a sensible number of babies! Do you remember how we worried that Caramel and Berry had missed because they didn't look pregnant until the last minute? I'm sure you will have 8 or 9 lovely babies. :D

Gill - don't they have four more days to go - aren't we expecting them Wednesday night? (I'm rubbish at maths :oops: ).
Oops - not as rubbish at maths as me it would appear. It is Wednesday, yes. :oops: Which makes her bulge even more alarming.

Teresa and Bronts - good luck for tonight - this is sooooo exciting!!!!!!!!!! :x[/quote]

Ditto me! I feel like an anxious auntie. :?

[Matty Day]

i had a big doubt on athena last night due to the fact that she woke me up 3 times running in her wheel :x when louis and aprodite never woke me up.

im tempted to try her with louis througth a wire grill for the next few nights to find out :x

thougth she has demolished the carrot i put in last night and has been digging crazy again :x

why is it one sign one way and one way the other :roll:

[Yaffle]

All of the Mums to be look great! I need to stop coming on this forum or I am going to end up with 100 hamsters before christmas :oops: I can't wait to see what you all have in your litters, I think I may have to get shopping for some more cages!

[Holly]

I've just done Smartie's final clean out (to her utter disgust, I've not seen her this stroppy before) and she seems bigger today. She still doesn't seem to have much of a tum compared to Truffle and Bronte but she's definitely developing the "water wings" look that her mum had when she was expecting:

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6680.jpg

How's Bront's doing - any news yet?

[Spuds Mum]

I think she looks like she is expecting Julie, as you say the water wings look is there, plus she seems rounder altogether.

Am sat in my hamster room, and am fairly sure that Bronte is giving birth now, lots of furious cleaning plus some wriggling and moving about. Thought I heard a little squeak earlier too.

I feel like Nanny in 101 dalmations.....although I hope we get a few less than 101 :wink:

[Basia]

She really is a beautiful girl and she looks like an expectant mum to me. I so love satin creams *sigh*.

edit - Posting the same time as you Teresa. Go Bronte, I'm guessing 15!

[Holly]

Go on Brontosaurus :D

I'm guessing 16 :wink:

[Jane]

I want to guess 13 :P

[Spuds Mum]

Well she is still going strong it appears! and I have seen one of the pups already.

Im not looking, Im over the other side of the room, but the tub is clear, and I saw her 'rearrange' a pup, bringing it up to the side of the nest and then shuffling it underneath her.

And, Julie and Gill, I thought you were meant to be my friends - 15?!! 16?!! lol
Well I guess as long as they are healthy then I am happy.

ooops another just came - queue the shocked raising of Bronte followed by furious cleaning.

Which of course is what I should be doing now of course, but I just need to feel near her, in case of difficulties. I'm glad she was due on a Sunday, as being the size she is, I would never have settled at work if it was a weekday she was due!

Not long now for you two huh? And of course just a little longer for Matty. :D

[Spuds Mum]

I want to guess 13 :P

Yes that is a much more reasonable number Jane, thank you my sweet.

I'm guessing (well hoping really!) for 11.

I think Bronte is hoping for.......No More!!!!

[Matty Day]

yep athena 14-15 days to go now so that means they will arrive just after the tame show :x on the 23rd or 24th march that the buety with chinese small litters thougth you do have to wait 5 more days :x

[Holly]

Oh Teresa, how lovely! You go, Bronts, my darling (bless her I feel like I'm having them - thank goodness I'm not :shock: )

I've told Will that Caramel's a grandma and our lot are aunts and uncles too :wink:

This is very exciting - didn't Princess have her lot in the afternoon as well?

[Spuds Mum]

Yes its really funny all of mine have had them from about 1.30 in the afternoon.

Im not sure why, as most reading on the matter seems to suggest they are likely to come in the evening through to the early hours of the 17th day? I'm quite glad though, cause if there are any problems usually atleast vets are available quickly.

the girls all seem to follow the same pattern too, so I think I am quite good at guessing when they are going into labour, they seem quite restless but dont like to leave the nest for long, and spend a lot of time making the nest just right interspersed with quite deep sleeping but only for short periods.

OMG Im not sure whether she is just cleaning a previous one or if another has just arrived. I want to tell her to stop it now!! :oops:

[Catja]

This is all very nail biting, its going to be an exciting and busy time for you! Can't wait to hear the final score, perhaps we should have had a sweepstake

[Holly]

How amazing for you that you are able to see it and Bronte doesn't seem to mind. I didn't see even a glimpse of a baby until mine were 10 days old (although I heard squeaks) and Caramel seemed so strange just before she was due to deliver that I left her alone and left the room in darkness - I always assumed she actually delivered them in the nest! She kept them covered totally and didn't leave the nest for 10 days other than to drink and pee!

I wonder what Smarts will do? She is an extremely people orientated hamster (which is why her strop this afternoon is so out of character) so perhaps she'll let me have a look (though I think I'll be too nervous to risk it).

[Mollz]

How very exciting! It all sounds good so far Teresa, let us know of any other developments.

I'm guessing (well hoping really!) for 11.

I think Bronte is hoping for.......No More!!!!

Ha - you wish! I'll jump on the bandwagon and guess between 14 and 18! Good luck to you and Bronte :D

[Holly]

Any more news, Teresa? :shock:

[Spuds Mum]

No no more news Julie, I still haven't done the ironing rofl!


I wish to formally announce the arrival of grandchildren for Caramel and Paws!

Mum too busy to write to her Mum and Dad, however, she seems to be doing well, and the pups are already making noises and seem very lively.

Bronte came out the nest to go to the loo an hour or so ago, and one little mite wriggled out of the nest already, but was gently put back by Mum.

There seem to be quite a few as Mum is having a hard time covering them all already, and as we walk past we keep seeing little wriggly pink legs, and milky tummies!

Congratulations Grandmas Holly and Souffle, and auntie Basia :x :x

[Matty Day]

sounds like you have twenty there :x

[Mollz]

So glad everything went well for you and Bronte. It sounds as if she is going to have her hands full - especially if they are escaping from the nest this early on!

[souffle]

Dear Bronte
I am very proud that I am now a grandad. Poly send his Uncle love to his tiny grandpups and Granny Pophammy is somewhat upset she did not get a mention, after all it was her who bred me, Pawaver the magnificent. Now you look after the puplets little madam and look after yourself too. I am off to smoke a sunflower seed and drink a toast of vitamin water to the new hamlets. Well done my dear
Your loving father
Paws
and Uncle Napoleon

[jayne]

Thats great to hear about Bronte! Go girl!

I am guessing ..... 12!!! :P

[PinkEmily]

I am guessing ..... 12!!! :P

Let the bets begin :x

[Basia]

Congratulations Teresa and Bronte, I'm glad she has delivered them all safely. How lovely to actually be able to see. I was in the room when Berry had her babies but I couldn't see anything, she was under the shelf.

[Spuds Mum]

Granny Pophammy is somewhat upset she did not get a mention, after all it was her who bred me, Pawaver the magnificent.

So sorry Pophammy! I apologise unreservedly, you are a very special Granny!

[Holly]

Congratulations Teresa and everyone else connected with Bronte in any way 8)

Oh and I still think there's 16 :P

[Spuds Mum]

Oh and I still think there's 16 :P

*gulp* I think there are around that number Julie, pasta for Bronte's breakfast this morning and she left the nest open - there was a definite scrum of pups in there! :D

[Spacemonkey]

Congrats to Bronte and her extremely large family :D

I love the way the babies stack themselves to confuse us as to their numbers :roll:

[Catja]

Congrats to all, have you got homes for them or are you planning to keep some of them?

[Spuds Mum]

We will probably keep at least one Catja, but I tend not to promise homes to other people in the early days in case problems happen before they are a couple of weeks old.

[Holly]

How's Bronts and the gang doing today then?

I finally believe for sure that Smarts is actually pregnant (her water-wings make her look like she's wearing another hamster round her neck today :shock: ) so I've updated our website with a page for the prospective Smarterones if anyone is interested :)

I'm going to run it like a diary, whith pictures when it's safe to take them. It's likely there won't be much to report for awhile - it was 10 days before I even glimpsed my last lot!!! :P

[Spuds Mum]

Brontes fine Julie, and I'm glad that Smartie is wearing her babies like a coat! :wink:

I had a long weekend off work this weekend so of course I've spent most of the day in the hamster room listening to those gorgeous little squeaks. Back to work tomorrow the

Bronte seems to be doing well, she is staying on the nest apart from the smallest forays out for the loo or to her food bowl, but then taking food back to the nest to eat. Just as Im typing this she has popped out of her nest and brought out 5 pups with her, having forgotten to detach them before leaving! She has returned 4 to the nest and one is still out, but wriggling back itself (bless it) - and she's seen it and all are now retrieved! so I know she has at least 5 that are well and healthy today!

She has built her nest into a veritable volcano around her like a good Mum, but needs to maybe learn a little about how tightly those babies latch on! :D

[Mollz]

It sounds as if Bronte has settled into motherhood already then, and I'm sure she'll do a brilliant job, even with her 16 babies :D It must have been very special to see the birth.

Sounds good for Smartie too than Julie, just looked at your website and I'm sure I'll be absolutely glued to it once pictures begin to be posted - I'm so excited and none of the litters are even mine :roll: (although hopefully a baby will be!!), imagine what I'm going to be like when mine come along.

Make sure we are all kept updated :wink:

[Matty Day]

update on Athena she is seven days now if she is pregnant. she refused to mate again that’s 3 days running now i am getting hopeful that she is pregnant. she is also very timid and is not her usual self she doesn’t’t like me handling her any more so I have been reading to her on the duc de Orleans (my up coming history course work) she is still putting the food away fresh and Harry hamster mix she is also looking a we bit bigger :x

[Spuds Mum]

Fingers crossed Matty those are good signs! :D

[Matty Day]

and she only a third of the way trougth her pregnancy if she is pregnant :x

[Holly]

Well Smarts has just one day to go - she's just popped out for breakfast (cheesy omlette!) this morning and I snapped a couple of piccies as she now looks pretty big (nothing like Bronts though Teresa :P ...says I, sweating at the thought of 17 :shock: ):

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6685.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6688.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o209/Holly_Day/IMG_6690.jpg

I've taken her wheel out - she hasn't used it the past couple of days - though she still likes to swing from the roof bars :roll:

I'm getting mildly nervous now - and it's not even me that's got to give birth to them!

<Edit> On reflection - OMG, she looks MASSIVE :shock:

[Yaffle]

Congrats Teresa and Bronte!

I've only just been able to check the post, I'm so pleased it's all going so well for you both. You're so lucky to have been able to be there for her, I would've loved to have been there for the birth of Yeti's litter.

Holly- Smartie is looking great. She seems to be a similar size and shape to what Yeti was, she also had huuuge water wings! Good luck, I'll be thinking of you both! Also, what is your web address?

[Holly]

Holly- Smartie is looking great. She seems to be a similar size and shape to what Yeti was, she also had huuuge water wings! Good luck, I'll be thinking of you both! Also, what is your web address?

Thanks Claire! (She looks bigger every time I look - eek!).

My website is on the www button just below this post :wink:

[Spuds Mum]

Ahhh I think she looks preeettty big Julie! And certainly she seems to be enjoying her omelette!

Are you at work tomorrow? Or will you be around to midwife? Its very exciting, hope it all goes well. :D

[Holly]

I think she does as well, Teresa - eek! I'd got myself all psyched up for a nice small, manageable litter (hark at me I'm not even the one doing all the work :P ).

I'm off tomorrow, if she accepts my presence I'll sit on the other side of the room in the dark but only if I'm sure it's not bothering her. At least I'm there in case (God forbid) there are any problems, though I'm not sure what use I'd be :?

She's built an enormous burrow-like nest (just like her mum!) so I won't be seeing anything I think.

[Mollz]

I think she does as well, Teresa - eek! I'd got myself all psyched up for a nice small, manageable litter (hark at me I'm not even the one doing all the work :P ).

I'm off tomorrow, if she accepts my presence I'll sit on the other side of the room in the dark but only if I'm sure it's not bothering her. At least I'm there in case (God forbid) there are any problems, though I'm not sure what use I'd be :?

She's built an enormous burrow-like nest (just like her mum!) so I won't be seeing anything I think.

Ha, the litter may be bigger than you were expecting then - she certainly doesn't look small :wink:
Let's hope you do get to see a bit of the birth, it would be a once in a lifetime experience and I'm sure that you would enjoy every second on it. Although it does sound like she has the nest specially prepared!

Fingers crossed for a safe and easy delivery. Keep us updated.

[Spuds Mum]

Its funny that Bronte is the opposite, I think we would be able to see her even in her Gabber as she leaves the nest open and like just now, I look across and she is on the nest with her nose buried into the bedding, but I can see a pup's tummy popping out from underneath her.

Good luck Smartie! (and Julie) :D

[Matty Day]

some quite perplexing news about Athena I put her and Louis in the mating pen and she tolerated him for a while they just ignored each other .except for him coming up to her for a bit thought he had just emptied some food into the pen. is she more interested mating or the food what do you think every one?

I am going to try latter with him with empty pouches of course.

Apart from that she doesn’t like being handled any more, eating for England and tunnelling like mad

[Spuds Mum]

I really don't know Matty. I'm not sure what is normal for chinese to be honest. You may just have to wait and see I guess.

Has Alex given you any advice on this? I'm not sure of any other chinese breeders :?

Good luck anyway

[Matty Day]

no I am just playing it be ear hopefully when I try against 930 they either mate or fight I am actually glad that if she is not pregnant and I hope in some ways that it works to night as there would be a strong chance the litter would be born on my birthday. I am going to just try again tonight

I have tried to get in touch with Alex i sent him an email 2weeks ago got no reply

[souffle]

Alex did mention that he would not be around much till July as he is studying very hard for his exams so that may explain things. If they do mate again tonight I would try and leave them together a lot longer Matty. As long as they are happy together leave them for as long as you can to get multiple matings and then you will have a better chance of pups. It is possible she is pregnant but I would not be sure. We would not personally try test matings with a syrian as it can stress the female and cause her to resorb the litter. We prefer to just wait and see till the gestation time is up. If no pups arrive then try again.

[Matty Day]

i dont blame him in the sligest its horrilbe a t gcse you just have to many subjects.

there currently running around a play pen togther there was a smal scuffle when i put them in but when they smelt each other they calmed down

[Holly]

Ha, the litter may be bigger than you were expecting then - she certainly doesn't look small :wink:
Let's hope you do get to see a bit of the birth, it would be a once in a lifetime experience and I'm sure that you would enjoy every second on it. Although it does sound like she has the nest specially prepared!

Fingers crossed for a safe and easy delivery. Keep us updated.

My thoughts exactly :?

She's even bigger tonight and she's got two lumps either side of her tummy that look like they are moving :shock:

Thanks for the good wishes, I'll have everything crossed tomorrow - for Smartie and for Truffle/Basia.

[Spuds Mum]

Me too - am at work tomorrow but will be rushing home to hear how things are going!

Good luck guys! :x (oops girls)

[Matty Day]

there still sitting around not fight its realy strange same a happened last time they have an hour yet anway :x

[souffle]

Maybe you should consider letting them stay together as a pair till they have some pups. Try them together for several nights and if they are still happy put them in one cage together and watch?

[Matty Day]

just treid boath cages the went beserk
and a nuetral cage as well

[Matty Day]

just sat there till twelve no harm done i am going to leave her now and assume that she is pregnant. and try again after two weeks if she is not :x

look on the bright side if she is not pregnant she will get a wee bit bigger and score more marks at shows :x

[Catja]

Just a thought but as we are up to page 12 on this thread, would it be worth starting a new Mating diary thread once Truffle and Smarties babies are born too? To follow the pups progress.

[Holly]

I guess it would make it less unwieldy.

I have no news so far, Smarts has been sleeping under her shelf for most of the day with the odd little rustle. About an hour ago she came out and went nuts picking up every scrap of j-cloth bedding that had fallen into the rest of the cage. She's been very restless (still fat so they aren't here yet) since then, right now she's attempting to chew the reinforced water bottle (totally normal behaviour for her :roll: ).

I'm just popping in intermittently to use the pc which she's used to but I'm staying out most of the time and I've got the boys sworn to being as quiet as little meeces.

[Matty Day]

update on Athena i now do think she’s pregnant when i handled her today and gently felt her tummy there were two lumps either side though they are not obvious to the eye yet which is good as i am hoping for a small litter 3 or 4 would be nice :x

And she is still eating like mad i just put her dinner in she eating better than me turkey vegetables and cheese

[Yaffle]

I'm sure it won't be long now. Yeti went well into the morning of the 17th day so nothing to worry about :P

[Matty Day]

2 weeks yet it takes 21 days with chinese

[Matty Day]

whell aprodite athenas sister got up i handled her and guess what no lumps :x

[Spuds Mum]

Well the signs are good then Matty! I really think they should make a pregnancy test for hamsters to save us all the uncertainty and worry, Im not sure how we would get them to pee on the stick though :shock: :wink:

[Matty Day]

im realy not to worreid either way if she not pregnant this time i can just remate her to louis anway and as the holidays are coming up no need to worry about being in bed by a certain hour

and im hoping it will amke her a wee bit bigger overall as she is a bit on the small side

[Holly]

I *think* they are either here or imminent!

No sign of Smarts this morning and she's done exactly what Caramel did and emptied the entire cage of substrate to pile up round the nest.

It looks like I'm going to see nothing for days again - I don't mind as long as she/they are ok. I've had a near sleepless night worrying about her/them as the last I saw of her last night (around midnight) was her swinging from the roof bars :roll:

I'm still not sure this is for me - its soooooo stressful - especially knowing you can do nothing for the litter and virtually nothing for mum if it all goes wrong.

[Spuds Mum]

It gets better though doesn't it Julie? And seeing those pups grow into healthy and happy hamsters is a good compensation for the worry.
Anyway, you don't need to make a decision now do you? See how it goes.

I'm sure they are here now,and though you can't see them, I think you will be able to hear them soon!

Well done Smartie, clever girl,

And well done Julie too! :D

[Basia]

It sounds as though they are here Julie. Truffle has done the same thing - a huge volcano shaped nest built up around the shelf. I guessed the babies had been born when I came home and saw the nest. The only reason I know they have is because I disturbed Truffle by putting porridge in for her. I did this because I was worrying as there was no movement or sound from the nest whatsoever, mother or babes. There isn't this morning either but half of the porridge has been eaten.
Any way I'm sure congratulations are in order. :D Its natural to worry, you love Smartie, and this is all new to us!

[souffle]

Dear Smartie,
I am now a supergrandad to multiple little hamlets it would seem :lol: I am pleased to hear of your safe delivery and you be sure to keep your humans in suspense for as long as possible. It gives them something to do you know. Many congratulations and remember to consult your dear mother if there is anything on your mind.
Your loving father and Uncle Napoleon
Paws.

[Holly]

Thanks you lot, I'm now at work which is probably the best place for me :oops:

That volcano nest is a bit of a giveaway isn't it? I'm sure they were there or imminent when I left but she's got total peace and quiet until tonight now so that's good.

You are right, Teresa - it does get better and I'll be ok once I know they are ok (which won't be yet!).

I'll give the Smarterones their own thread once I know they are here for sure :wink: ...

Paws probably has at least 40 grandchildren now :shock:

[Spuds Mum]

I guess we ought to do separate threads to make it more manageable, as it does get confusing as to who is answering which post etc. I have put mine here http://www.hamstercentral.com/forum/vie ... 0553#30553 (http://www.hamstercentral.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=30553#30553)

40 grandchildren? wow that's a lot of babysitting Grandad Paws. And I do hope you have a very large lap for all those youngsters to crawl on for a story! :D :D
[/code]

[Basia]

I sent a PM to Julie and she has asked me to post her reply for advice. She is very worried about Smartie but doesn't want to stay on the computer in the room because she doesn't want to disturb her.

I got back from work about half an hour ago and went in just to feed her and the others. She came rushing out - she looks thinner, I think, though it's hard to say as she was sort of fat all over rather than having an obvious bump - and she hasn't been back to the nest, she's chewing the bottle now

I tried to peek not the nest and the part under where the food bowl is which is her usual sleeping spot is definitely empty - she's got a covered part further in where the shelf is still wide - the bedding is packed in tightly and I can't see any movement or hear anything.

Caramel never left the nest like this. I don't know if she's had them and they are dead/she's killed them or they still haven't been born. Either way things look bad - tomorrow is day 18 and all my books say they'll be dead if they haven't been born by now.

We are obviously worried - I don't think there are going to be any babies whatever - I don't know what to do.

I need to leave her alone to see if she goes back into the nest so I need to log off now. Could you post this on the main forum and get some advice for me? I'll check back later if she goes quiet.

I don't know whether to look in the nest or not - maybe I should see if she'll come out in the ball? Or should I not? The problem is, if she's not had them and they've died in utero I need to get her to the vet tomorrow (ours is an animal hospital and I know they operate on hamsters)to save her life.

I knew something was wrong last night I think - I'm devastated and so is Will, he's crying in his bedroom, he thinks she's going to die.

I'll check back in half an hour if she's in th nest and quiet.

If anyone had advice they can give Julie will be back on line in about half an hour. :(

[Spuds Mum]

Try not to panic Julie, there may be a litter under that packed bit of the shelf.
They are all different and, being quite an energetic little girl she may just have got distracted when she went to get water, especially if you were in the room.

see how she is tomorrow morning, and I would take her to the vets if you are fairly sure pups haven't been delivered.

I've sent you a fuller reply by pm
thinking of you x

[Matty Day]

well athena is at day 11 if she is pregnant
she went nuts last night and trashed her cage she has bureid her house up to the roof tossed loads of bedding out, and genrally eaten loads and she is defintly bigger than her sister
and she isnt using hew wheel very much thougth she had bureid it when i woke up this morning only 3 thirds of it were visble.

i think she is pregnant and it could be a double celbratoin on the weekend of the thame show louis could win somthing and become a dad in the same weekend :x

[Holly]

I've only go a minute for this -

I have just fed Smartie and she came out of the nest - she looks very big, sort of swollen, so I got Will to offer her her ball which she readily hopped in to. I've had a look in the nest without touching anything and there are definitely no babies and nothing to suggest they were ever in there and have been eaten.

I really need advice now, I'll phone the vets when I get back from school at 9am but any advice from any breeder here would help me greatly.

I think realistically there is little or no chance for the babies (if there are any and all this isn't just a phanton pregnancy - she's pretty big though) and I have to do what's best to save Smartie.

Should I be taking her to the vet? I don't want to make things worse by moving her but neither do I want to abandon her if she needs help. Please help, anyone?

[souffle]

I dont like the sound of this Holly. Vet for smartie. There may be a pup stuck and she is unable to deliver. X ray should confirm pregnancy. If she is pregnant the pups are unlikely to survive but Smartie may survive an op to remove the uterus effectively spaying her. Sorry this is short and sharp I also am really worried. It may also be a pyo with either an infected uterus full of pups or an infection. Does she have any nipples red. They can go on a bit after day 17 but not too long. I have only heard of it happen very occassionally. I would NOT go with antibiotics if it is a pyo as in my experience they will only provide temporary remission. If it is this (any discharge?) you should ask for a spay straight away to give her the best chance. If she is still strong, she is young and would likely have a good chance of a normal life afterwards. Heart is with you guys. :cry:

[Bourne Valley Hams]

I have never known a Syrian go more that 2 days overdue - and I have had a lot of litters -they are usually pretty much spot on 16 days.
Sounds like she either has a problem giving birth or an infection.
I would get her to the vet today.

[Holly]

Well it seems that Smartie has had me (and a few other people!) fooled!

We are just back from the vet and, as soon as I got her out, I knew she was ok :oops: .....it was almost embarrassing showing the vet this ridiculously healthy and beautiful specimen of hamsterhood!

Basically the vet is sure she's had a phantom pregnancy - she has no signs of having a baby stuck - in fact no abdominal tenderness at all - and no signs of having been pregnant and having destroyed the litter (ie prominent nipples). If I'd have picked her up (which I obviously didn't want to do when I still thought she was pregnant or nursing I'd have spotted that - duh. There's also no indication that she has an infection - he says she's the picture of health. He also said it isn't unusual for hamsters not to get pregnant on a first mating, which I know anyway. She does look fatter than before - all the extra food I've been giving, I guess :roll:

I'm very impressed with the vet, he knew his stuff and didn't say anything at all I know not to be right - I always am impressed with this practice. I'm to take her back if she shows any sign of distress in the nest 24 hours but he's fairly confident (and so am I) she was never pregnant.

So thanks to everyone who offered me advice and support, it is so appreciated. Last night we were devastated at the thought of a lost litter and Smartie maybe dying - today I'm just ecstatic that she's ok. I need to go into school at playtime and tell Will as he went to school in tears, bless him.

I'm sorry to everyone who was hoping for a Smarterone baby (it's Sod's Law - if I'd have had no homes for them she'd have delivered 20 babies :roll: ). I plan on seeing how she goes for the next week to 10 days (and maybe bringing her to Thame once she's had a rest!) and then we'll try her again if everything is ok.

I'm so relieved I feel like I've won the lottery even though we don't have any babies (yet) :D

[Yaffle]

Oh Holly I'm so relieved for you! Naughty Smartie having us all fooled :lol:

[Catja]

Oh Gosh Julie, I am so so pleased, I was so worried last night. I have been risking the sack (hell I am leaving next week) :lol: just to keep checking.

I feel so happy, I know there are no babies but I was just so worried for Smartie and you and Will

[Basia]

Well that's a relief.
I had everything crossed that she had just missed or a phantom pregnancy. She will probably win her class when you take her to the show, all that condition from being fed so well!

[Holly]

Thanks guys :)


I plan on seeing how she goes for the next week to 10 days (and maybe bringing her to Thame once she's had a rest!) and then we'll try her again if everything is ok.


Just quoting myself a moment - does anyone know if phantom pregnancies actually do any harm to a female? I realise she'll be tired - she's definitely been preparing for a birth big time - and that it might take a while for her cycle to resume normally? Does anyone know how long I need to wait before trying her again? She's coming up to five and half months old and I can't wait too long, obviously.

[Basia]

Obviously my experience with hamsters is limited but experience of phantom pregnancies is not.
I would probably mate her as soon as she 'stands', she is likely to be fit having been fed up in preparation for babies. Maybe try a different male.

[Holly]

I don't have a different (suitable) male! Mars and Button are her brothers and Rolo is a Satin so I'll have to give old Tobes another go :P

[Basia]

Ooops, yes forgot Smartie and Rolo are satins. You could give poor old custard a heart attack! :P
Time for Toby to step up to the plate again then.

[souffle]

Oh my have I been worried and am as releived as you now Julie.
'Souffle slopes of for a stiff drink'
When you said she was all swollen up I was so very worried that somethng was very wrong. Her hormones must have gone a little haywire. It is quite common for them to miss first mating especially at this time of year when the light is confusing them. I would agree with Basia and try her again as soon as she will stand. She is obviously in the mood for babies!

Dear Smartie,
Thats my girl. You fooled em good and proper. Your granny Bailey did that too! I expect it's in your genes.
Your loving father
Paws

[Holly]

Thanks you two :) I shall go ahead and see if she stands tonight!

Souffle, I forgot about Bailey's phantom pregnancy - I remember you telling me now. This has certainly been a learning experience :?

<EDIT> Forgot to say that she's look "swollen up" to me for several days now - the water-wings look, I guess. I sort of meant she still looked the same, not like she'd delivered babies. I guess her hormones must be well haywire, I doubt she'll stand tonight but you never know.

[Yaffle]

I hope she stands for you soon, it must've been a little disappointing that there weren't any babies, I'm sure that now Smartie and Toblerone have had a 'trial run' everything will go smoothly for you next time :D

[Mollz]

Gosh, I've just read through all of the posts from last night and earlier this morning was almost having a heart attack, until I saw your posts from later on this morning confirming that everything is alright. I'm so glad she is ok, and please don't worry about her not having the babies - after all I would rather I went without a baby from her than her to have had problems and got ill or worse (and I am sure that everyone else who was hoping for a Smarterone feels the same).

Look at it this way, at least she has had a few weeks of building up her strength and getting into prime condition before she is even pregnant! I hope everything goes well if and when you decide to mate her again.

Also, as far as I know, phantom pregnancies don't harm any animals (although I should imagine that they do confuse them a little - I really don't know whether they realise that they are expecting babies, or nature just tells them that for some reason they need to build up a big nest and stock up on food). Are you sure she had a phantom pregnancy and it wasn't just us lot believing she was pregnant :D

I am just so relieved, and you must be too. I think you deffinately deserve a stiff drink :wink:

[Holly]

Thanks you two, it is disappointing but compared to the scenarios I lay awake imagining last night today has been fantastic really! I'm so happy she's ok and looking so well and healthy not having the litter doesn't seem so bad.


I have decided to try her tonight - though she hasn't stood at all since we mated her so I don't know what makes me think she'll stand tonight!

Mollz, I'm fairly sure she's had a phantom pregnancy - and that she thought she was having babies, bless her. As I said she hasn't stood in 18 days (though it's true we haven't had her out since the weekend but she hadn't stood up until then - certainly not like Smarts as she's regular as clockwork usually) and she's done all the things pregnant females do - eating more, drinking more and trashing her cage/moving nests - as well as building the "volcano nest" and getting restless on the 16th night. Like souffle says her hormones are all over the shop - I hope she's also right about her being in the mood for babies.

Because of all this I'm now going to be having two litters close together - due to the amount of people I've had asking me about baby hamsters (I've had to tell two people at school, 3 people at work and one person on the internet that there would most likely not be a baby in "this litter" for them!) I'm not too worried about homing two litters in close sucession so.......if Smartie doesn't stand tonight and Molly does I shall mate Molly/Mars first and Smarts as soon as she settles into a routine again!

So Matty - your baby Maltemar (or should that be Marteser?) will likely be here soon (I say likley as I've learned today that you can't take anything for granted :P ).

Teresa the Dubaku/Princess line might continue sooner than we thought. :wink:

[Basia]

It may sound mean but I would break her nest up. The rabbits would often hang around a nest for a few days if I left it, they often really do think they have given birth with a phantom pregnancy, but if I moved it away they would quickly return to normal. Not sure about hamsters but that is what I would do.
I'm glad you are feeling better and thinking forward. Good luck with the forthcoming matings!

[Matty Day]

[quote="Holly"]

So Matty - your baby Maltemar (or should that be Marteser?) will likely be here soon (I say likley as I've learned today that you can't take anything for granted :P ).

quote]

that is no problem i have more money than i expected at this time and my expenses are going to be a lot less as I have decided to postpone learning to drive to the summer

and as I am pushing my Syrian litter forward from may to December its an advantage all round as

and Louis and Athena’s litter if she is pregnant will all be on the sales table at north Somerset hopefully (except the boy I am keeping) and 1 my friend wants.

[Spuds Mum]

My goodness, have I just had the longest day at work worrying about you all Julie.

Unfortunately not even a single chance to take a sneaky check on here! :cry:
Ive come home and rushed right on to the computer - and thank goodness she is okay. I am so relieved for you and Will. I cant say any more than that, apart from you weren't the only one laying there worrying last night! :roll:

Anyway, I am so pleased, and I have never been so pleased in my life to have been fooled as Smartie fooled us. I'm going to have a stiff drink tonight on Will's behalf (I guess you may have one for yourself Julie, but if not, let me know and I'll have yours too!)

**hugs of relief**

[Matty Day]

well I have just checked on Athena’s weight she is getting heavier cant tell buy much as my scales are not very accurate it seemed near the 75g mark than the 50g which she was at before highworth thougth she dosent look much bigger she is filling out on the flanks gradually

the signs are looking good considering she trashed her cage last night and is franticly nest building.

and eating loads

thought i am not a hundred percent convinced yet i probly wont be until i hear the sqeaks

[Holly]

Neither of my girls are standing tonight :(

I think it should be Molly's turn tomorrow night so keep your fingers crossed for us. At just over four months old she's slightly younger than I planned to mate her but she's big (180g tonight) and I'm realising that, if things don't go according to plan, first mating them when they are over 5 months doesn't give you much time to get it right :?

Smartie is lively and happy - she's been out for a run and she does look the picture of health.

*cogs turning*

I may bring her tomorrow - I have two LH Satins entered (Molly and Rolo). Rolo's coat is still greasy and he isn't looking his best - whereas Smarts is blooming :?

[Spuds Mum]

Good idea Julie! I think thats brilliant thinking, and I can tell her off for worrying her Mum with her little prank! :wink:

I still can't quite believe that she fooled us all so well, although of course Vala did the same.

It looks like it will be another family outing, though Dubaku will miss gossiping about girls with his brother in the next pen! :x

[Holly]

Good idea Julie! I think thats brilliant thinking, and I can tell her off for worrying her Mum with her little prank! :wink:

I still can't quite believe that she fooled us all so well, although of course Vala did the same.

It looks like it will be another family outing, though Dubaku will miss gossiping about girls with his brother in the next pen! :x

You going to Thame nest week? I'll hopefully have de-greased Rolls by then and they could have a chat then :wink:

Vala did exactly the same as Smarts, didn't she? (And Bailey before she had the Baisons). I can't believe how only slightly disappointed I am we have no babies tonight - I guess it's because last night and this morning I thought we were going to lose our beloved Smarts - and tonight she's on her 10th km on the wheel!!!!!

[Matty Day]

fingers croseed for milly julie were going to have to come to an agreement and sort everything out at thame about payment etc :x

i rely wish i had some better scales thougth i would love if i caolud know exactly how much athena has put on :x

im getting more confident every day that she is pregnant :D

[Spuds Mum]

Yes, I think we have all felt that relief. When Vala didnt deliver I remember Souff posting that dreaded word pyro - and my heart sunk :cry: so then suddenly the elation when you find that you the only thing you have really lost is something that wasn't there in the first place is amazing :x

Thame is out for us I think - but will just check on the distance.

Love Google Maps but hate living at the far end of nowhere!
The only way we could do it is if we foisted ourselves on my lovely cousin who lives just outside Oxford. Otherwise its a 7 hour round trip :cry:

[Holly]

Thanks Matty - we can have a chat next week at Thame, although I won't be 100% Molly's expecting until I - well until I rehome them, I think, this time :?

Teresa's Dubaku is Molly's Dad - what we really need from this (prospective) litter is a couple of boys with his glorious long coat and Mars's size - with the lazy temperament of both of them :wink:

I know what you mean about the scales - it does my head in trying to get accurate weights on the Syrians - can't imagine trying to weigh Chinese :shock:

On the subject of Smartie - is she likley to come on heat soon or do they tend to take awhile to be ready to mate after a phantom pregnancy?

[Holly]

Yes, I think we have all felt that relief. When Vala didnt deliver I remember Souff posting that dreaded word pyro - and my heart sunk :cry: so then suddenly the elation when you find that you the only thing you have really lost is something that wasn't there in the first place is amazing :x

You know how I feel then! It's like winning the lottery today :)

Thame is out for us I think - but will just check on the distance.

Love Google Maps but hate living at the far end of nowhere!
The only way we could do it is if we foisted ourselves on my lovely cousin who lives just outside Oxford. Otherwise its a 7 hour round trip :cry:

Oh that's such a shame :(
When's the next one we are both at I wonder?

Oh *slaps head* - it's tomorrow :oops: :P

[Spuds Mum]

I can't say I know for sure Julie, but I think it does put their cycle out a little bit. I guess there will be people with loads of experience tomorrow who will have more of an idea.

The reason I dont know is that by the time Vala didnt deliver, Yowie had gone home, tired but happy!

[Matty Day]

Thanks Matty - we can have a chat next week at Thame, although I won't be 100% Molly's expecting until I - well until I rehome them, I think, this time :?

Teresa's Dubaku is Molly's Dad - what we really need from this (prospective) litter is a couple of boys with his glorious long coat and Mars's size - with the lazy temperament of both of them :wink:

I know what you mean about the scales - it does my head in trying to get accurate weights on the Syrians - can't imagine trying to weigh Chinese :shock:

On the subject of Smartie - is she likley to come on heat soon or do they tend to take awhile to be ready to mate after a phantom pregnancy?

i forgot to mention I don’t mind a satin cream or a cream as ive already started to ask around and i shall be getting my first female Syrian in September and I don’t mind as I don’t mind getting a normal black eyed cream or a satin one ill fit in with you on this one :wink: before you say it I have changed my plans I am going for a Christmas litter now

Weigh Chinese on my current scales is a nightmare there not very sensitive and my eyesight is not to good when it comes to fiddly dials and small print I really wish I could get some digital scales so I end up estimating to the nearest 5 grams

[Matty Day]

Athena’s now on day 12 she has built a big nest and tunnel complex she has abandoned her hamster house now :x i weighed sister she looks roughly 15 grams heavier than sister now :x (though my scales are not very good) and she is eating /hoarding loads

I am really beginning to think she is pregnant on the weight of evidence for it :x

[Holly]

Well.....we have just mated Molly and Mars!

It wasn't the easiest of matings (Mars, lazy so and so, kept trying to go to sleep :roll: ) and when he wasn't sleeping he kept trying Molly's patience by flipping her over. :?

We had to leave them together for over half an hour in the end and I think it's all worked.

And that's ALL I'm saying on the matter...

NO mating diaries
NO photos of the happy coulple
NO detailed diary of the "pregnancy"

Let's see if not chancing fate works any better :P

[Basia]

Good Luck Julie :D (sleeping on the job eh? That's a classic)

[Spuds Mum]

Fingers crossed Julie that we become grandparents in 16 days! These lazy boys really can take 'laid back' to a new level can't they? :wink:

Hope it goes well this time, I have a good feeling
(oh and Amelie says that is yeugh and disgusting!) :x

[Matty Day]

It wasn't the easiest of matings (Mars, lazy so and so, kept trying to go to sleep :roll: ) and when he wasn't sleeping he kept trying Molly's patience by flipping her over. :?
:P

he should take some tips from my louis he new what to do straight away :x are you sure yo can keep me informed at least i dont mind either way

[Mollz]

Good luck Julie. I guess that really shows how laid back Mars is :D

[Moosley]

I have a stunning BEC male named Mr Squishy who has had to be written off as a 'pet' because he is so lazy he wont even mate! His excitement seems to be laying (sideways) over the female and using her as a pillow to sleep on, or chewing her ears until he gets bitten!

[Matty Day]

Athena’s now on day 13 she is looking a lot bigger now she just came out for some food not around her belly she has just filled out nicely all round even if she is not pregnant she is going to score a lot higher in shows thought I am sure I saw a small bulge round her stomach :x she has started to sleep more than ever and as added more tunnels to her nest :x

[Catja]

written off as a 'pet' :?

[Matty Day]

well I managed to handle Athena tonight with out her getting to stressed and she does have to definite non visible lumps on either side of her belly :x

[Matty Day]

well im now 70 percent sure she is pregnant she is way bigger than sister has definate lumps either side her rear is biiger now i think chinese look diffrent to syrians when they are pregnant they get bigger more on the rear.

se has improved her burrow 3 exists now and is tuking in to some prime turkey breast

louis could be a dad and win a show in the same weekend :x

[Bunsey]

congratulations Julie, i hope it all goes well!

My chinese always makes about 4 entrances to her nest and won't go in them if someone is looking!