Breeders of Chinese hamsters? Rare?

[racinghamster]

Just a random question really. Since adopting my little chinese female Prinny recently from another forum member, I suddenly realised what shy but endearing little hamsters they are and wondered why they were not more popular (or AS popular) as other hamster species are? Is this due to the fact that they look like mice? Or is it that they are difficult to pair up and breed from easily?

I did read one article that said they only breed in the pitch dark and the female will sometimes attack and kill the male. :???: I was`nt sure what to read into that, but could`nt help thinking to myself, `no wonder they are not very easy to find!` :mad:

It seems the only place to find them for sale these days are in Pets At Home, or if your lucky, free-ad websites. I know there are probably breeders out there who do breed the odd few litters but might not concentrate solely on chinese. I just wanted to ask, who does breed them on a regular basis and will they (in your opinion) become as popular as the russian dwarf, Roborovski and the syrian as pets?

I certainly hope so because I think they are wonderful.

[fluffymunchkins]

Chinese are very difficult to breed, as you read its quite common for the female to turn on the male before they can breed.
Vectishamstery (in southampton) is where Bacardi is from, shes a very popular chinese breeder and her babies are always high in demand :)
There are other chinese breeders, but Vectishams is the only one I know that specialises in chinese.

[lisab]

There is only a small number of chinese breeders compared to other species.

I have just started to breed them for me to show. poor little boy did come get picked on by my girl and did have a nasty bite on his back with blood and have had to give him some extra attention to make sure it doesnt get infected, so its very difficult if you couldnt face it.

You are right they are lovely and very sweet natured. Its a shame there arnt more breeders.

[Vectis Hamstery]

N'aaaw thanks, FM - you're too kind!

There are a few UK breeders, but as Lisa says not as many as syrians (robo breeders are an equally select group). From North to South: Red Devil and Lilliput (Midlands), Wellington (London), Severn Vale (Bristol), Me (Southampton). I'm not sure if Cheverton Hams is still breeding Chinese in Yorkshire as I only infrequently get to Northern shows. There are a couple of other people I'm working with to try and establish the black-eyed white chinese. It does make it challenging to find new outcrosses.

You do need your wits about you when breeding Chinese but I haven't found them too hard to breed by following the advice from other breeders. Chinese breeding patterns do seem very sensitive to daylight patterns - I have daylight spectrum bulbs now in the hamstery which work well. My hams have rarely had more than the odd nip in the process, although my first stud male did get his bum scarred (I've changed the mating tank setup since).

[racinghamster]

That`s what I thought guys, thanks. It`s strange though because I done some googling and some of those `Pets Classifieds` websites seemed to have a good number of chinese hamsters either for sale, or breeders advertising (I saw a few I recognised who are NHC registered) but they are way down south! But there does seem to be a small influx of them scattered around the country.

lisab, that`s a shame your wee male had to endure a battering like that! Saline (one pint boiled, cooled water and one teaspoon salt) is good to use on cuts and grazes. I use saline all the time if I see any little scabs or cuts on my mice. It`s safe and cleans. :)

I`m happy just with the one female at the moment but in the future, I would have room for another cage/tank since I don`t breed myself but like to give a nice home to a needy chinese rather than buy from a shop.

I just wondered how easy or how difficult it was to breed them and actually make their profile as a pet as popular as some of the other hamster breeds. Given that the chinese have lovely natures and rarely bite, I would have thought they would be more popular than some of the dwarf hamsters, but perhaps this is something that will depend a lot on their availability and profile.

[racinghamster]

Just seen your post vectis, thanks! :) My head has definately been turned by these endearing little hamsters and it would be nice to have a breeder `up north` so to speak. The black eyed whites are stunning are`nt they? I`ve seen a few images of them online and since my favourite mouse colour is black eyed or red eyed white, these little cuties I can see being a big attraction. Although I do love the normal/wild tone I have to admit. ;)

[Vectis Hamstery]

Yay! Another Chinese hamster convert :D It is a shame they're not more popular, but you only have to meet one to love them (I have a few 'syrians only' people on my waiting list lol). All three varieties in the UK are gorgeous. I said I'd only do normal and dom spot, but you can't say no when offered BEWs, can you? ;) Hopefully getting the new varieties established will help give the species a boost (BEWs first then the pied and striped - got my work cut out for me!). There are piccies of all 5 varieties here (http://purplekatkritters.tripod.com/dwarf/Dothcolors.html#stripe).
To slightly hijack the thread and tempt you further, here's Brighstone, my little BEW lad!
http://i912.photobucket.com/albums/ac323/vectishams/L1050669.jpg

[Hamtastic]

Aw, the Purple Kat Kritters doesn't have well-working links :( I was a little excited since Albany, NY is very close, but I can't tell if there are any breeders on the site near it as well.

[SnickersTheFirst]

Ooooh, a Chinese breeder in London? Why did I not find this sooner? :mad:

The BEW and striped Chinese are stunning! :D

[racinghamster]

The piebalds are also lovely. They look a little like variagated? Very nice indeed. :) With the good work the UK breeders are puting into this it will definately make all the difference to the Chinese becoming more popular I feel.

Brightstone is a cutie vectis! :) My Prinny had a smash party last night. I woke up this morning and her eggbox had been chewed to bits and her toilet roll tube aswell! :mad: I`m bidding on a bigger tank for her on ebay so fingers crossed. ;)

[KatiePillow]

Racing ham - I think what puts a lot of people off is the males airbags ;)

[racinghamster]

That`s true KP. It was actually a male I was after but when I was offered Prinny, I was more than happy to have her. I`m so glad I did now because I adore her and love her antics! :) So I definately won`t be biased in the future between males or females since they live singly anyway so maybe I can have one of each! :cool:

I`m one of those people who rehome unwanted mice and hamsters so it makes it that bit more rewarding for me knowing that I`m giving a needy ham a home and a good life.

[KatiePillow]

I know, sesame is a gorgeous little girl, she's so graceful and interesting to watch, I'd say she acts the most natural out of all my hamsters.
I adopted her at 6 months when she'd never been handled, so she's still not comfortable with me holding her, but I put her in the playpen in a tube, and do a health check once a week.

I think they're a lovely species, but one, like robos, that really would benefit from being from a breeder.

[racinghamster]

Yes I think pet shop chinese hamsters could potentially be more problematic due to the fact that they don`t get as much contact as they would from a breeder. My wee girlie is around a year old,but came from a home where the teenager got bored with her and none of the family really bothered with her, so Quedos (member on here) was asked if she wanted both the females (thinking they were living in the same cage) but they had already been seperated. So not wanting to turn them down, she took them on, but soon realised she had too many hamsters so asked me if I wanted one! :)

I try to handle Prinny once a day if I can, but she`s also happy for me to tidy her cage while she potters around looking up at me! I just scoop her up gently, give her a wee kiss and then gently lay her down again in her cage, or will get her out while she`s inside a tolilet roll tube and sit it on my knee. It does`nt take her long to come out!

[mangoandmimi]

aww the stiped chineses are so cute :3
hehe my mum has been completely put off male chineses when she saw them at the show lol, i have to say i was pretty shocked too but they were still so sweet :Px

[racinghamster]

Well all I can say is, we need MORE chinese hammie people! :) They are wonderful little creatures and MUST have the recognition they deserve. I only have one at the monet and already I am smitten by her. :)

I just hope that while breeding these hamsters for colour mutations that it does`nt harm the breed. I only say that because the fancy mouse world had exploded into something I can only describe as breeding for colour and type rather than the health of the animal. Especially the larger show mice where some breeders (and there are many let me tell you) will keep breeding mice just to get perfection and many mice are culled because of the over breeding. I know this does`nt happen in the hamster world (thank goodness) but when you have a wonderful little agouti/normal colourway, why change that to suit the trend of the pet trade?

There are only three colourways that I know of in the chinese hamster and those are normal/wild, dominant spot and the rarer black eyed white. But already you read about these `lethal` genes in the dom spot variety and it makes me nervous that genetics play a big role in the health of these animals and that this might continue to be manipulated just to reach an end goal? Not a criticism, just something I feel needs properly looking at.

The dominant spot is a lovely colourway, but should it stop at that? Will we end up seeing argente and black chinese hamsters? The mind boggles!

[thelittleteacup]

i also love chinese hamsters :) i have a ww and a campbells and my chinese is my secret fave! shes just so elegant and dainty with longg legs lol...thats why i called her twinkle toes! :) ive kept lots of hamsters but i always make sure i have room for a chinese! also a second for what kaire pillow said twinks acts the most natural out of all my hamsters!

[Vectis Hamstery]

I guess, racinghamster, that's where it's important to ask about the code of practice/ethics of the breeder you're getting your hamster from. Members of NHC affiliated clubs have to abide by the breeding code (you can find it in the NHC handbook), and the show standards are set out for the health of the hamster, e.g. head shape allowing proper brain and eye development. As a club member, I breed to further the species in my own little way. I'm working with BEWs because I love them and want to improve their size and type. They're sweet, healthy little beasts but it will take some work longer term - I want to breed GOOD BEWs, not lots of BEWs! I also need to get them approved by the NHC Standards committee, who look at things like genetics.

All breeding is 'manipulating the genes to reach an end goal'. After all, I select the parent hamsters for type and colour to breed closer to the standard. It's not at any cost though, as hamsters with health or temperament problems (no matter how nice looking or how much they are winning) are excluded from breeding in line with the NHC breeding code. It's gutting when when it's my champion I can't breed from, but no-one said breeding was easy. Believe me, breeders do think about maintaining health and vigour as well an ensuring safe pairings. I keep a 'pure' normal line to try and re-establish the lovely mahogany colour which has been washed out to a degree by the dom spot pattern (the UK robo breeders have done this since the introduction of husky to preserve the normal colour). As a club member, I don't breed purely for pets, so what the pet trade wants isn't an issue. Yes, there are people interested only in what's perceived to be 'rare' but that's where selection of future homes is key. Anyway, all of my future BEWs are promised to breeders within the hamster fancy for a very long time!

Sorry for going on. I feel strongly about breeding ethics!

[racinghamster]

You explained that well Vectis. And your right about selective breeders when it comes to selling or swapping breeding animals for the wellbeing of the species. It`s when non-NHC back door breeders start pairing up pet shop animals with no real background that problems might arise, but obviously there is no control over this. Chances are most of the chinese hamsters around these days are pet shop sourced, so unless the hamsters are from an established registered breeder who keeps records of their stock, the hamsters background will most likely always be non existant.

In the mouse fancy, there are many varieties these days, but I always prefer the simple white mouse! Yet some see white mice as boring and won`t even keep them, which is sad.

Lets hope the chinese hamster shines and becomes recognised as the lovely pet hamster it truly is. :)