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Old 03-01-2019, 10:05 PM   #1
marstalvi
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Join Date: Feb 2019
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Question Mojito: Progress/Advice

I posted an introduction a few days back, but I have some updates & questions!

Mojito is the new Syrian hamster I brought home (from the pet store) on Feb 3
This might be a bit long, but I've tried to break down our progress so far.

I expected him to be a lot less active than my 2 previous dwarves have been, and I was definitely correct. My most recent dwarf (Mint Julep) was on her wheel almost constantly & I loved watching her! I tried to provide her with as much enrichment as I could, but I never got to the point of handling her for more than a few seconds every once and a while.

My biggest goal is to get more comfortable handling my hamsters, which is one of the reasons I wanted to try a Syrian this time, since they tend to be a little bit calmer and less flighty.
I've had Mojito for a little bit less than a month, and so far I have had little to no opportunity to spend time with him, since he seems pretty happy just burrowing in his corner and only comes out around 1-2 am. I've seen him out earlier in the evening a few times, and I've tried to hand feed him treats when I do see him, but he's definitely still very shy and scared of me reaching into his cage, so I want to make sure he's comfortable coming out of his burrow before I keep bothering him too much.

I'm completely content on being patient, and his comfort is my number one priority, so I don't want to stress him out any more than I need to.

I scatter feed him a seed mix roughly every other day and I just bought some pellets to add to that. I've also been feeding him herbs/fruit/veggies as treats when hand feeding or will leave in the enclosure for him to find if I don't get a chance to see him out of his nest.

He stashes most if not all of his food in his nest. So far, in the month I've had him, I've also given him one Whimzee treat and one of those dried corn-on-the-cobs, and both have disappeared into his bedding by the next day.

He lives in a 40-gallon breeder tank. When I first brought him home I filled the tank with around 4 inches of paper bedding on the bottom but since getting him I've adjusted the following:
1. Deepened the paper bedding to around 6 inches
2. Sectioned off a quarter of the enclosure with a bendy bridge & grape vine log and filled it with a shallower area of aspen bedding to provide a different texture and allow enough vertical space for his new wheel
3. Switched the medium sized flying saucer wheel to a Carolina Storm Express wheel (which I discovered him using the first night he got it, so I'm very happy--I'm not sure if he was actually running on the flying saucer, I got the saucer initially because it was the only safe wheel I could find immediately that was large enough for him)
4. Added a sand bath in the corner just in case he would be interested--I wish I had had one for Mint Julip, since I know dwarves tend to be more likely to actually use them. So far, I know he's at least been in it based off of the bedding mixed in with it.
5. I've provided him with a variety of chew toys which he's pretty much ignored. There's a few of the very basic chewing sticks that he seems to like though.



I'm interested to hear people's thoughts. I know every hamster is different, but if anybody has any advice, I would love to hear it!

I attached a photo of his enclosure for clarification! He sleeps in the far right corner.
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Old 03-02-2019, 04:30 PM   #2
mangoandmimi
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Default Re: Mojito: Progress/Advice

It can be difficult when they wake up so late, it isn't good to force them up of course but I've had some success feeding treats and talking to them gradually earlier to get to a more suitable waking hour. Usually the veggies and favourite treats. You could try taking him out via a tube to try and tame him in a bin or playpen but it's better to wait until they're more comfortable with hands in the cage. Best to keep the lights down and just lots of gentle talking and eventually they tend to get more used to your presence.

Not sure if it's hidden but where is he nesting? They need a large area to retreat to otherwise they can feel quite exposed and nervous. Something at least the size of a shoe box instead of the tiny houses pet shops sell. If you have a shoe box then you can cut the base out and half bury it, so you can just lift the lid off to check inside instead of having to remove the entire box. While you're at it I would increase the bedding depth to 8 inches if you can as Syrians can't really burrow in only 6 inches of bedding - might be difficult in a 40 gallon breeder but do what you can
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Old 03-03-2019, 09:31 PM   #3
marstalvi
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Default Re: Mojito: Progress/Advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by mangoandmimi View Post
It can be difficult when they wake up so late, it isn't good to force them up of course but I've had some success feeding treats and talking to them gradually earlier to get to a more suitable waking hour. Usually the veggies and favourite treats. You could try taking him out via a tube to try and tame him in a bin or playpen but it's better to wait until they're more comfortable with hands in the cage. Best to keep the lights down and just lots of gentle talking and eventually they tend to get more used to your presence.

Not sure if it's hidden but where is he nesting? They need a large area to retreat to otherwise they can feel quite exposed and nervous. Something at least the size of a shoe box instead of the tiny houses pet shops sell. If you have a shoe box then you can cut the base out and half bury it, so you can just lift the lid off to check inside instead of having to remove the entire box. While you're at it I would increase the bedding depth to 8 inches if you can as Syrians can't really burrow in only 6 inches of bedding - might be difficult in a 40 gallon breeder but do what you can
I'd given him 2 smaller houses as options before along with the bendy bridge but he built his nest in the corner instead, so I've been wanting to add something big enough for him. I just got one of the larger wooden houses meant for rats & other bigger rodents, and I think he's feeling much more comfortable already!

He's definitely piled the paper bedding pretty deep in the corner, but I tried to add a little more as well.
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Old 03-04-2019, 07:18 AM   #4
mangoandmimi
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Default Re: Mojito: Progress/Advice

I think they often do like to nest in corners or at least against an edge of the cage. The guinea pig houses are a much better size for them so I’m glad he’s feeling happier now.
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Old 03-04-2019, 08:46 AM   #5
Pebbles82
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Default Re: Mojito: Progress/Advice

Oh my goodness - ha ha - I looked at the photo and at first thought the hamster's head was sticking out of the top of the tank! Must put my glasses on

I think he has had time to settle in and a bit of time to adjust to the changes you've made, depending on how recently you've made them. Our last Syrian was also very shy, nervy (and a bit lazy) and would never come out at all unless I actually got him out for taming.

Whenever you last made changes in the cage, give it a week and then I would start with taming out of the cage. The best way to get him out would be in a tube or hamster ball with a nice smelly treat in it - eg a bit of cucumber or a very small bit of plain cheese (eg cheddar). It's how I always had to get our last Syrian out. Our current syrian is more active and confident and comes to the cage door when he wants to come out, which is usually about every 3 days. So they do like to have some time left alone as well.

Without a cage door in a tank he would show you in some other way.

Anyway - if you have a hamster ball it's easy enough to just lower that into the tank near his nest with a treat in and he'll probably just walk into it, then pop your hand over the entrance and lift him out in the ball, pop the lid on and carry him carefully in the ball to where you can let him out safely for some taming - you could either rig up a playpen area on the floor, or use the bathtub if you have one. Bathtub taming is good - the sides are high, they can't escape and you can add the odd toy or hidey place in there.

I am not a great fan of hamster balls for exercise - but it is useful to have one for transporting a hamster from one room to another safely, by carrying them in the ball, setting them down and taking the lid off to let them climb out in the new location.

Another way is a tube - with one end near his nest and the treat at the far end. This takes you being confident as when he goes in the tube for the treat you need to cover both ends with both hands to lift him out so don't jump if you feeling him pushing at your hands. If you're nervous he may bite (unlikely) then wear gloves when doing it.

You can't carry them far like that in a tube safely - I used to then put one end of the tube in the hamster ball (ie hamster ball didn't fit in the cage). If the playpen area is very nearby you can just put the tube down in that. If you have to walk toanother room - eg the bathroom, and you don't have a hamster ball, then put the tube down in a box or similar (high enough sides he can't jump out), and carry him in the box to the other room - put it down on its side so he can then walk out. I would still put something over the top of the box just in case! They can jump quite high.

They behave differently out of the cage than in it. Their cage is their territory. When in a safe area like the bathtub or playpen just let him run around and occasionally try and stroke him on the back with one finger. Wear gloves or use an old toothbrush instead of a finger if you're worried he might bite - again unlikely. He may jerk round as if to bite or warn your finger off, so wait and try again 10 minutes later. Maybe try this 2 or 3 times in the first session. Use your finger without gloves if you can as he'll get used to your scent and touch quicker. By next session he will probably have accepted being stroked on the back by a finger and not jerk round. So you can then move onto cupping a hand under him while he's walking around - just slide the palm of your hand under him but let him walk off. Then try sliding the palm of your hand under him and lifting it about 1cm but still let him walk off. Once you can do that fairly often, you should be able to pick him up easily - but take it slowly - so cup your hand round and let him walk from hand to hand like a tunnel at first - just for a few seconds - I find they get a bit annoyed with that after a few seconds. He should then be hand tame - used to your scent, and trust your touch.

Even then, when they're young and quite fast (and he will be fast out of the cage!) they often don't like being held for long and picked up much but they get better as they get older. But it's important to keep up reglar contact and out of cage time so they don't slip back into being too independent.

If you have a playpen rigged up it can be good to get him out in that every 3 days or so and sit in it with him - still with a few toys in the playpen. They run over you as if you're an object and he'll soon get used to you then. Be careful to keep away from the sides or they can try and use you as a ramp to get out!.

In the bathtub he will probably just slither up and down the sides at first trying to get out - which is a good time to try a stroke on the back. But eventually he may explore any toys or tunnels you've put in the bathtub. If you've used the ball - leave it in there. Ours used to hop back in it when he'd had enough and wanted to go back to his cage.

Even in a large playpen area they will spend most of the time trying to work out how to get out. If he starts digging at the corners after 15 minutes or so he's probably had enough so put him back in the cage. Hiding the odd treat in the toys in the playpen distracts them and they spend time foraging for them.

Cage:

I think he will feel more secure in the cage and come out more if he has a large house. They will ignore a small house because they like to have somewhere dark to retreat to which is why he's burrowed down. But I've found they are scared of coming out when it's open above. With a large house he will feel more secure. A tank can also feel a bit open and exposed above so a large tube or tunnel would help him feel more secure.

So what I would do is make a shoe box house (cardboard is light and will sit on tp of the deep substrate) and pop it over hiscurrent nesting area in the corner. Maybe pushed down a bit so the base is part under the substrae. Cut the base out of a shoebox and keep the lid as a lift off roof - so you can check inside without having to take the house out. Cut a hole for a door near one end of one of the long sides as an entrance and put a bendy stick bridge tunnel over the entrance door. This will mimic a burrow and be nice and dark inside. The bendy bridge also makes a ramp up to the flat roof. If the shoe box is large enough you could put a litter tray inside it - at the door end (they tend to nest furthest away from the door where it's darker so the litter tray is usually used at the other end).

I've found when you give them a large house, they move their pee corner inside the house and have an ensuite bathroom - so putting a corner litter tray inside should work well.

He will then feel more confident being out and about in the cage as he has a large comfortable house that's dark inside. Puta big pile of torn up strips of plain white toilet paper near the house (but not in it) and he'll probably build a nest in the house with it and can still burrow down in the substrate and bury his hoards under the house.

This has always worked best for me. I did try deeper substrate and no house with our last syrian and his ears were always down when he emerged from under the substrate - the burrow kept collapsing and was a permanent stinky mess! He was much happier with a house that mimicked a burrow.

If you can get one of those large cork log tunnels (reptile stores sell them) for the centre of the cage, that will also help him feel less exposed from above - a big dark tnnel to go from one end of the cage to the other (it could straddle the divider) and also something to climb over with an interesting texture.

I think the divider could be a bit lower so it's not such a drop to the other side so smaler bendy bridges might be better. Either that or raise the wheel as far as it will go on it's stand and have more substrate in the wheel side - so it's less of a drop and the cage isn't quite so segmented.

More floor toys generally to fill the space and hidey places - will also help him feel more secure. Things like coconut huts and cardboard tubes etc.
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Old 03-11-2019, 03:35 PM   #6
marstalvi
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Posts: 5
Default Re: Mojito: Progress/Advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serendipity7000 View Post
Oh my goodness - ha ha - I looked at the photo and at first thought the hamster's head was sticking out of the top of the tank! Must put my glasses on

I think he has had time to settle in and a bit of time to adjust to the changes you've made, depending on how recently you've made them. Our last Syrian was also very shy, nervy (and a bit lazy) and would never come out at all unless I actually got him out for taming.

Whenever you last made changes in the cage, give it a week and then I would start with taming out of the cage. The best way to get him out would be in a tube or hamster ball with a nice smelly treat in it - eg a bit of cucumber or a very small bit of plain cheese (eg cheddar). It's how I always had to get our last Syrian out. Our current syrian is more active and confident and comes to the cage door when he wants to come out, which is usually about every 3 days. So they do like to have some time left alone as well.

Without a cage door in a tank he would show you in some other way.

Anyway - if you have a hamster ball it's easy enough to just lower that into the tank near his nest with a treat in and he'll probably just walk into it, then pop your hand over the entrance and lift him out in the ball, pop the lid on and carry him carefully in the ball to where you can let him out safely for some taming - you could either rig up a playpen area on the floor, or use the bathtub if you have one. Bathtub taming is good - the sides are high, they can't escape and you can add the odd toy or hidey place in there.

I am not a great fan of hamster balls for exercise - but it is useful to have one for transporting a hamster from one room to another safely, by carrying them in the ball, setting them down and taking the lid off to let them climb out in the new location.

Another way is a tube - with one end near his nest and the treat at the far end. This takes you being confident as when he goes in the tube for the treat you need to cover both ends with both hands to lift him out so don't jump if you feeling him pushing at your hands. If you're nervous he may bite (unlikely) then wear gloves when doing it.

You can't carry them far like that in a tube safely - I used to then put one end of the tube in the hamster ball (ie hamster ball didn't fit in the cage). If the playpen area is very nearby you can just put the tube down in that. If you have to walk toanother room - eg the bathroom, and you don't have a hamster ball, then put the tube down in a box or similar (high enough sides he can't jump out), and carry him in the box to the other room - put it down on its side so he can then walk out. I would still put something over the top of the box just in case! They can jump quite high.

They behave differently out of the cage than in it. Their cage is their territory. When in a safe area like the bathtub or playpen just let him run around and occasionally try and stroke him on the back with one finger. Wear gloves or use an old toothbrush instead of a finger if you're worried he might bite - again unlikely. He may jerk round as if to bite or warn your finger off, so wait and try again 10 minutes later. Maybe try this 2 or 3 times in the first session. Use your finger without gloves if you can as he'll get used to your scent and touch quicker. By next session he will probably have accepted being stroked on the back by a finger and not jerk round. So you can then move onto cupping a hand under him while he's walking around - just slide the palm of your hand under him but let him walk off. Then try sliding the palm of your hand under him and lifting it about 1cm but still let him walk off. Once you can do that fairly often, you should be able to pick him up easily - but take it slowly - so cup your hand round and let him walk from hand to hand like a tunnel at first - just for a few seconds - I find they get a bit annoyed with that after a few seconds. He should then be hand tame - used to your scent, and trust your touch.

Even then, when they're young and quite fast (and he will be fast out of the cage!) they often don't like being held for long and picked up much but they get better as they get older. But it's important to keep up reglar contact and out of cage time so they don't slip back into being too independent.

If you have a playpen rigged up it can be good to get him out in that every 3 days or so and sit in it with him - still with a few toys in the playpen. They run over you as if you're an object and he'll soon get used to you then. Be careful to keep away from the sides or they can try and use you as a ramp to get out!.

In the bathtub he will probably just slither up and down the sides at first trying to get out - which is a good time to try a stroke on the back. But eventually he may explore any toys or tunnels you've put in the bathtub. If you've used the ball - leave it in there. Ours used to hop back in it when he'd had enough and wanted to go back to his cage.

Even in a large playpen area they will spend most of the time trying to work out how to get out. If he starts digging at the corners after 15 minutes or so he's probably had enough so put him back in the cage. Hiding the odd treat in the toys in the playpen distracts them and they spend time foraging for them.

Cage:

I think he will feel more secure in the cage and come out more if he has a large house. They will ignore a small house because they like to have somewhere dark to retreat to which is why he's burrowed down. But I've found they are scared of coming out when it's open above. With a large house he will feel more secure. A tank can also feel a bit open and exposed above so a large tube or tunnel would help him feel more secure.

So what I would do is make a shoe box house (cardboard is light and will sit on tp of the deep substrate) and pop it over hiscurrent nesting area in the corner. Maybe pushed down a bit so the base is part under the substrae. Cut the base out of a shoebox and keep the lid as a lift off roof - so you can check inside without having to take the house out. Cut a hole for a door near one end of one of the long sides as an entrance and put a bendy stick bridge tunnel over the entrance door. This will mimic a burrow and be nice and dark inside. The bendy bridge also makes a ramp up to the flat roof. If the shoe box is large enough you could put a litter tray inside it - at the door end (they tend to nest furthest away from the door where it's darker so the litter tray is usually used at the other end).

I've found when you give them a large house, they move their pee corner inside the house and have an ensuite bathroom - so putting a corner litter tray inside should work well.

He will then feel more confident being out and about in the cage as he has a large comfortable house that's dark inside. Puta big pile of torn up strips of plain white toilet paper near the house (but not in it) and he'll probably build a nest in the house with it and can still burrow down in the substrate and bury his hoards under the house.

This has always worked best for me. I did try deeper substrate and no house with our last syrian and his ears were always down when he emerged from under the substrate - the burrow kept collapsing and was a permanent stinky mess! He was much happier with a house that mimicked a burrow.

If you can get one of those large cork log tunnels (reptile stores sell them) for the centre of the cage, that will also help him feel less exposed from above - a big dark tnnel to go from one end of the cage to the other (it could straddle the divider) and also something to climb over with an interesting texture.

I think the divider could be a bit lower so it's not such a drop to the other side so smaler bendy bridges might be better. Either that or raise the wheel as far as it will go on it's stand and have more substrate in the wheel side - so it's less of a drop and the cage isn't quite so segmented.

More floor toys generally to fill the space and hidey places - will also help him feel more secure. Things like coconut huts and cardboard tubes etc.
This was all extremely helpful, thank you!

He's had a new wooden rat/guinea pig house for a little over a week now and it's made a HUGE difference. Now when I put my hand in the enclosure, he can come out of his burrow while still peeking from inside of his house! When I start ruffling the bedding outside of his house, he tends to peek his head out of his nest and sometimes will usually come out to investigate.

I bought some more aspen bedding today to deepen that section as much as possible (it won't be by much because of the wheel), but he gets to the other side of the divider by climbing over the grapevine log which makes kind of a ramp for him, so he doesn't have a drop at all there.
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Old 03-11-2019, 03:47 PM   #7
marstalvi
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Default Re: Mojito: Progress/Advice

Some progress a little over a week later:

Ever since getting his new house, I'm able to coax him out of his nest more often! I've seen him out drinking water or just poking his head out of his bedding several times, and in the evening I've been hand feeding him a treat.

Today I fed him a slice of dried banana when I got home, and then offered some seed mix from my palm. He's still super shy, but I let him nibble my fingers a bit and he ended up climbing into my hand to eat, which is the first time that I've been able to touch him for more than a second!

I haven't taken him out of his enclosure at all yet, because he's still so hesitant about coming out while my hands are in the tank, but I feel much better than I did earlier!
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Old 03-14-2019, 06:22 AM   #8
JennySTL
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Default Re: Mojito: Progress/Advice

He sure is cute! It's amazing the difference a big house can make. I did a shoebox house and mine just loves it.
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