Opinions on "NATURAL" setups

[HolleyAkers]

Hello all,

I'm new to the forum, we've had our syrian for 6 months or so and a robo for couple years. My question is regarding "natural" tank setups. I've seen many beautiful setups on pinterest and would like to get a few opinions on the safety of this type of set up.

Problems I'm concerned with since hammys tend to chew:

--many of these have some kind of moss, my gut tells me this isn't safe to injest.
--it looks like some use craft wood pieces to build levels, how to connect them? Glue?

Has anyone had experience with setups like this?

I've attached a few pics for examples, these are not my setups.

Thank you in advance.

[AmityvilleHams]

I've always felt the same way about moss. Some people will refuse to acknowledge the risks of it and say Germans use it so it must be fine, but that completely ignores the questionable at best edible aspect and the very real issue that it poses to hamster respiratory systems. There's also a potential very harmful negative environmental impact from the use of particular mosses, which is also a very good consideration to account for.

A very small section with a thin layer of 100% coconut fiber could be an acceptable choice if used appropriately, but it also holds moisture which is why you need to be careful of just how much you use. However, this option is known to be safe if ingested and unlike moss is a highly sustainable renewable resource(many companies manufacture coco coir/coco fiber/etc with what is essentially wasted coconut husk from the coconut farming industry - things like coconut milk and oil for example).

In the USA, a good coco fiber option is this:
https://www.chewy.com/zoo-med-eco-ea...onut/dp/123767

Keep in mind with wood you'll want real solid wood of a known safe species that is kiln dried. I wouldn't use any kind of plywood since there are potential dangers if chewed and ingested.

A good alternative platform are these:
https://www.petmountain.com/product/...?variant=16651

I'm not typically a fan of Kaytee, but they did very well with that particular product. Be sure to pick the right size for the individual hamsters though, I would stick with medium for a robo and large for a Syrian. This would work great for chewing prone hamsters since they can't be chewed and destroyed, plus in my experience they've been relatively easy to clean.

[alpacassei]

Natural setups are much more enriching for hamsters as far as I’m concerned.

I don’t know much moss tbh so I recommend doing your own research. dried spagnum moss is what most people use.

School glue/pva is safe for hamsters and work well with wood, the only downsides are it takes a while to dry and isnt waterproof. Make sure to choose a safe wood, there are lists online!

Terracotta plant pots look great and keep claws trimmed. Cork logs and grapevine branches are two of my favourite items for natural setups. Oat, millet, flax etc sprays, dried flowers and leaves, and hay are important in providing enrichment and encouraging foraging behaviours too. I don’t like to use woodshavings because they don’t hold burrows well and theres a risk of scratches but white or brown paper bedding looks just as good.

As Amity said, coconut fibre such as eco earth is great for small digging areas. Hamsters also need a large sandbath for grooming and toileting, this is especially important with robos who are desert hamsters and ideally need a third of their cage to be sand.

[EmmaAndChester]

Moss is absolutely safe to use in hamster enclosures. Realistically, your hamster isn't going to be eating it - but it's a great way to provide them with multiple materials for their bed. If they do accidentally ingest it, it is fine - it's just not the tastiest thing in the world. The only real issue with moss (particular sphagnum) is the environmental issue; it is not a renewable resource, and the harbouring of sphagnum destroys boglands. But, there are plenty of mosses to choose from and I hate to be a bearer of bad news, but moss is already readily available in the pet trade - and it will continue to be so, as there are species in captivity that require it in their environments. If you don't want to buy it its fine, but its not going anywhere any time soon.

I've never heard of moss posing a threat to respiratory systems, and i've used it in natural set ups for years (never once had a hamster - out of 30+ - with a URI). Now Coocnut fibre, that's another story. That stuff is dust when dry, so you must be careful if you want to use it in your set up. You can't let it completely dry out, but you dont want it wet either.

A couple of concerns with the set ups you're using as inspiration; please do not use bendy bridges as barriers unless you completely seal all the gaps. Those gaps on the top act as literal guillotines for tiny paws & legs - and we have seen many cases already where hamsters have broken legs or have had to have legs amputated from bendy bridges being used like this.

That 'bark' type material is also not recommended for use in hamster set ups. It is known to resinate (leak a very sticky resin that will destroy your hamsters cheek pouches, their fur, and whatever else it leaks into) and are often made with nails; which are not safe if your hamster chews it. Additionally, they're also notorious for splintering.

The bedding isnt deep enough in any of the set ups pictured either. Syrians need at least 8-10' over a large area (at least 775"2) and for dwarfs, you'd want at least 620"2 with a 6" (min.) depth throughout.

I know a lot of people who use craftwood for building materials and haven't reported any problems, and you can use a hamster-safe glue to connect them if you wish. Generally speaking, i've never met a hamster who has payed any interest to chewing solid platforms - so its not a huge issue.

Here's a couple of my natural set ups I've done over the years. I really can't recommend items like cork longs, bamboo roots, and grapevine enough

https://imgur.com/gallery/pzyyd


https://imgur.com/gallery/417KJ

[Ria P]

EmmaAndChester, those set ups are absolutely amazing!

I bought snuggle moss from Rodipet which is dry and meant for rodents, put some into my Syrian's coconut hut...and he chucked it all out again! I'm pretty sure that its safe to use though.

I got some eco earth, soaked it, crumbled it then dried it which took ages as its very damp and retaining moisture to be used in reptile tanks, put some in his cage...one sniff and then he ignored it. I wouldn't recommend it either because it gets so very dry because its not meant to be dried.

Also, in the detolf photo there are succulents which i don't think are suitable because hamsters eat plants and don't know a house plant from an edible herb.

Two of my three hamsters live in fairly natural habitats and they are very easy to set up as long as people set them up from a hamster's point of view. There are lots of suitable and safe things available, some already mentioned. Long, bendy ladders are very versitile and bendy bridges, coconuts, the Ferplast guinea pig houses with or without the front panel make very good and inexpensive supports for heavy items, wicker tunnels and baskets, terracotta, pebbles, ceramics, seagrass and the list goes on.

[stan]

EmmaAndChester, I love those set-ups.

I have natural set-ups for my two. I think they offer a win-win situation for owner and hamster. The set-ups look beautiful as a centrepiece in the room, so 'going bigger' with the enclosure is easier. Therefore the hamster gets a bigger, well enriched, home. You get to look at look a little piece of nature in the living room.

There are meant to be some plants that are hamster safe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xI6igchDljU but I prefer not to keep any in my enclosures.

I've tried coconut fibre, and I too thought it was dusty. My Syrian had it for a month over summer. He seemed to like it. I think it was quite cooling when it was hot, as it always felt a bit colder when I put my hand in it. I wasn't too sure of the safety so I removed it.

Mine both have Rodipet snuggle moss. It only assists with humid environments if you wet it. It's very dry in the cage, and I use it to block up any gaps on bendy bridges, and stick it into some gaps in the cork logs. Neither of my hamsters care much for eating it, or pouching it for anything.

I always have a lot millet / flax / oat sprays about. It keeps my hamsters busy, and I can watch them doing their hamster thing.

I use some non-natural bits too. My Syrian has a rat hammock, made of material, which he likes to sit in. He's not much of a chewer, so it's not a problem. My Dwarf currently has a plastic wheel. Wood ones do look nicer, and are safer if your hammy likes to chew, but they can also get disgusting quickly if you have a hammy that likes to pee and run.

[Ithuviel]

Wonderful post, wonderful ideas. Thank you for all of this

[HolleyAkers]

Originally Posted by AmityvilleHams

I've always felt the same way about moss. Some people will refuse to acknowledge the risks of it and say Germans use it so it must be fine, but that completely ignores the questionable at best edible aspect and the very real issue that it poses to hamster respiratory systems. There's also a potential very harmful negative environmental impact from the use of particular mosses, which is also a very good consideration to account for.

A very small section with a thin layer of 100% coconut fiber could be an acceptable choice if used appropriately, but it also holds moisture which is why you need to be careful of just how much you use. However, this option is known to be safe if ingested and unlike moss is a highly sustainable renewable resource(many companies manufacture coco coir/coco fiber/etc with what is essentially wasted coconut husk from the coconut farming industry - things like coconut milk and oil for example).

In the USA, a good coco fiber option is this:
https://www.chewy.com/zoo-med-eco-ea...onut/dp/123767

Keep in mind with wood you'll want real solid wood of a known safe species that is kiln dried. I wouldn't use any kind of plywood since there are potential dangers if chewed and ingested.

A good alternative platform are these:
https://www.petmountain.com/product/...?variant=16651

I'm not typically a fan of Kaytee, but they did very well with that particular product. Be sure to pick the right size for the individual hamsters though, I would stick with medium for a robo and large for a Syrian. This would work great for chewing prone hamsters since they can't be chewed and destroyed, plus in my experience they've been relatively easy to clean.

Thank you for the response!
I use coco fiber for the reptiles, I never considered it for the hamsters.

[HolleyAkers]

Originally Posted by alpacassei

Natural setups are much more enriching for hamsters as far as I’m concerned.

I don’t know much moss tbh so I recommend doing your own research. dried spagnum moss is what most people use.

School glue/pva is safe for hamsters and work well with wood, the only downsides are it takes a while to dry and isnt waterproof. Make sure to choose a safe wood, there are lists online!

Terracotta plant pots look great and keep claws trimmed. Cork logs and grapevine branches are two of my favourite items for natural setups. Oat, millet, flax etc sprays, dried flowers and leaves, and hay are important in providing enrichment and encouraging foraging behaviours too. I don’t like to use woodshavings because they don’t hold burrows well and theres a risk of scratches but white or brown paper bedding looks just as good.

As Amity said, coconut fibre such as eco earth is great for small digging areas. Hamsters also need a large sandbath for grooming and toileting, this is especially important with robos who are desert hamsters and ideally need a third of their cage to be sand.

Thank you for the response.
Cork and grapevine are great ideas, natural and safe, I'm already using some in our reptile tanks. I'm sure I can find them online, but are there oat, millet, flax or other sprays that you reccomend?

[HolleyAkers]

Originally Posted by EmmaAndChester

Moss is absolutely safe to use in hamster enclosures. Realistically, your hamster isn't going to be eating it - but it's a great way to provide them with multiple materials for their bed. If they do accidentally ingest it, it is fine - it's just not the tastiest thing in the world. The only real issue with moss (particular sphagnum) is the environmental issue; it is not a renewable resource, and the harbouring of sphagnum destroys boglands. But, there are plenty of mosses to choose from and I hate to be a bearer of bad news, but moss is already readily available in the pet trade - and it will continue to be so, as there are species in captivity that require it in their environments. If you don't want to buy it its fine, but its not going anywhere any time soon.

I've never heard of moss posing a threat to respiratory systems, and i've used it in natural set ups for years (never once had a hamster - out of 30+ - with a URI). Now Coocnut fibre, that's another story. That stuff is dust when dry, so you must be careful if you want to use it in your set up. You can't let it completely dry out, but you dont want it wet either.

A couple of concerns with the set ups you're using as inspiration; please do not use bendy bridges as barriers unless you completely seal all the gaps. Those gaps on the top act as literal guillotines for tiny paws & legs - and we have seen many cases already where hamsters have broken legs or have had to have legs amputated from bendy bridges being used like this.

That 'bark' type material is also not recommended for use in hamster set ups. It is known to resinate (leak a very sticky resin that will destroy your hamsters cheek pouches, their fur, and whatever else it leaks into) and are often made with nails; which are not safe if your hamster chews it. Additionally, they're also notorious for splintering.

The bedding isnt deep enough in any of the set ups pictured either. Syrians need at least 8-10' over a large area (at least 775"2) and for dwarfs, you'd want at least 620"2 with a 6" (min.) depth throughout.

I know a lot of people who use craftwood for building materials and haven't reported any problems, and you can use a hamster-safe glue to connect them if you wish. Generally speaking, i've never met a hamster who has payed any interest to chewing solid platforms - so its not a huge issue.

Here's a couple of my natural set ups I've done over the years. I really can't recommend items like cork longs, bamboo roots, and grapevine enough

https://imgur.com/gallery/pzyyd


https://imgur.com/gallery/417KJ

Thank you for the response and pics!!

Are there any particular mosses you prefer other than spagnum? I have some frog moss left from a recent reptile build, is that something that might work?

I do agree with the wood in the inspiration pics, I had planned on a bit of cork bark and/or grapevine, as some others mentioned here.

I'm so glad you told me about the bendy bridges because they look like they'd make great barriers, and now I know how to utilize them properly to prevent injury.

For the craft wood, it's so readily available and there are so many options, I'm glad it works.

The variety of plant sprays you have in your setups, where do you find things like that? I would love to incorporate those as well.

Thanks again!