Sand bath?

[horseyhammygirl]

No, some people on Hamster Hideout were saying that the Chinchilla Sand had high contents of silica, 70 percent apparently, was silica. So they were saying that the Chinchilla Sand was potentially dangerous for hamsters. On Hamster Hideout, on the 'Greasy Syrian Fur'question. Can you check it out and see if there's any truth in it?

[cypher]

So many people use chinchilla sand without any problems I think we can take it as safe, I really don't know what the silica content is but I think the main concern with sand/dust is usually that it's too fine & will be inhaled potentially causing respiratory problems which is why we use the sand not the dust.
You will often come across conflicting opinions on things & there often isn't hard proof one way or another but I've used it for years now without any concerns.

[horseyhammygirl]

Ok thanks!!! I will order the sand.

[Pebbles82]

Yes I see what you mean. That post is quite specific. It doesn't say if it is the Supreme Chinchilla sand, just seems to lump them all together. It's a new one on me and I noticed it's from 2011. I've always been told that the Supreme Chinchilla sand is fine. I have found it dusty myself when pouring it out, but once settled it seems ok. I just bought a box of the Supreme one actually, I'll go and see what it says .....

"Supreme Science Bathing Sand for Chinchillas, hamsters, gerbils and degus. 100% natural, dust free, free of bacteria, naturally absorbent ...." It goes on to say more of the same but no list of ingredients.

There's another thread on HH from last year querying the same thing and people saying it is a certain US brand of Chinchilla sand that isn't safe - but doesn't mention Silica. Another post on there says steer clear of the Brands of Chinchillla sand that contain Silica.

It would seem strange if all Chinchilla sand was bad and made of Silica because the Germans use it extensively in natural cage set ups and nearly all dwarf hamster owners have sand baths, and most Syrian owners.

There is no information on Supreme's website, so I have emailed them and asked them to list the constituents. We shall see! I hope it isn't Silica based.

Double posted along with Cypher there!

[horseyhammygirl]

Wow! Thanks for doing all that research!!! That was really helpful.Smudge is very grateful!!

[Pebbles82]

I'd like to know myself now! Haven't had a reply to the email yet. I'll let you know when I do.

[Pebbles82]

Had a reply to my email. It says

"....we can confirm that the product is 100% Sepolite Sand ...."

I think it should say Sepiolite as the word Sepolite seems to be incorrect and there is such a thing as Sepiolite sand. They go on to say that it is fine to use with Hamsters.

I then started to try and find out more about Sepiolite and other types of sand but haven't found anything very concrete really. Sepiolite is a type of clay and a magnesium silicate apparently (from Wikipedia). I think, from what I've read, that nearly all sand and rock contains Silica. And yes Silica dust can cause a form of cancer called Silicosis, but it seems to be one of those things where processing workers who have been exposed to it a lot contract it, or builders who do a lot of sandblasting inhale fine dust.

This sounds to me like saying coal causes pneumonconiosis (the lung disease that is common in coalminers), whereas people who have coal fires don't get it from filling up their coal buckets and burning it, it is the mineworkers who mine it and breathe the dust constantly who get it.

Another post (not a very scientific one though) says the silicates are bound to Sepiolite so aren't released in the air. It seems a bit of a chemistry minefield! What I have learned is that all sand is just ground down something or other, whether it is rock, shellfish, pumicestone or whatever. Sepiolite also seems to be used in an awful lot of products, including binders for animal feeds I read in one place.

A gerbil forum said Aragonite sand (sold for reptiles) has less silica but is not good for hamsters if they eat it.

The good news is, it isn't fuller's earth (called attapulgite apparently) which apparently is not good for hamsters.

I think you'd need a degree in chemistry to know whether silica in sepiolite is relevant or not, because there are issues like chemicals being bound to each other and not airborne, as opposed to in manufacturing where they release chemicals from one product to make another product.

I also had a look at the Rodipet site to see what type of bathing sand they sell for hamsters.

The translation says

"pure natural product with no additives
maintains fur and skin
of pumice stone
WITHOUT attapulgite
WITHOUT sepiolite

Sand bath for daily skin and coat care
Species-appropriate grooming for your rodent.

BiMSi® bathing sand is cleaned thoroughly and then dried completely. BiMSi® is a pure natural product, manufactured and guaranteed without additives. BiMSi® bathing sand contains optimal for grooming small rodents grain size, so that dwarf hamsters, gerbils, hamsters, degus and chinchillas her fur gently, maintain and remove excess sebum.

Well Rounded ...

the grains of sand BiMSi® bathing. Unlike bird sand or simple quartz sand BiMSi® has no sharp edges and can thus clean the coat of your rodent care. It consists of pure pumice, ground, cleaned and dried as it is recommended for hamsters and gerbils. Not only the fur is maintained - and the claws can be worn in BiMSi® bathing sand. In Rodipet you will also find the matching sand bathing bowl.

BiMSi® Bath Sand is a very high quality product to the grooming of your rodent.

Rodipet® recommends this product for
all rodents maintain their fur in special bathing sand, such as Dwarf hamsters, gerbils, hamsters, lemmings, degus, fancy mice, chinchillas and many more"

So they say pumice sand is good for hamsters and by saying no sepiolite they are suggesting sepiolite is not good. Yet elsewhere things say pumice is not good! I think it is generally accepted that attapulgite (fuller's earth) is not good.

It does sound very complicated, but it is not the case that all Chinchilla sand is just made of Silica as was suggested in the post you read, but Silica is naturally found in all rock and sand.

Mum forums have posts worrying about Silica in childrens play sand. It seems Silica is in all sand, but only inhaling the dust is the issue (which I guess is why hamster forums say only get bathing sand and not bathing dust).

It would need a chemist to say whether or not the silica is bound to the chemical make up of particular types of sand I think, rather than some loose thing that can be inhaled.

I think Piebald is a chemistry type bod aren't you Piebald?

[cypher]

I have to confess to being a bit of a research nut when it comes to hams lol! but I do think sometimes we can just over complicate things & tried & tested is best! I have read a lot about different sands over the years but am really none the wiser when it comes to hams & sands but knowing that many of us have used chinchilla sand for a long time without any signs that we should be concerned I just decided it was time to stop worrying over that one!
I did try some Rodipet sand (not the BIMSI one) it was a while ago & I can't remember which of their sands it was but I really wasn't impressed tbh & decided I was better off sticking to the supreme science chinchilla sand.

[Pebbles82]

I know Cypher, I just always got the Supreme one because it was widely recommended. I think that's all you can do. Decided to look into it because Horsey Hammy girl asked, but it is still quite obscure! I think the basic advice to get sand rather than dust is what counts, as dust can be inhaled and that seems to be what the issue is about. Sounds like all sand contains a type of Silica naturally.