Elderly robo kidney problems?

[velma]

Hector my robo has gotten quite elderly. He is definitely at least 2 years old now - he's a p@h adoption so I don't know exactly but I've worked out the youngest he be WA turning 2 in March or April. I know robos can live longer so he's not technically really old but he's aging quite badly. It's not sudden so it's not ill health, it's been happening since he was about 18 months. He's starting to look pretty scruffy now

My main concern at the moment is that I suspect he has kidney problems. Recently he has been drinking a lot more and peeing more (not more frequently but producing more when he goes) and it seems to me to be more dilute. I am sure he doesn't have a UTI and diabetes, as I understand it, is very unlikely in robos so I think he has old man kidneys that aren't functioning quite as well as they should. If he were younger I'd take him to the vet but as I suspect it's a sign of old age and not illness I don't really want to disrupt him and stress him out if there's nothing they can do. Obviously I'll take him if there's nothing I can do at home to help.

I know that hamsters need less protein as they age so I think if I change his diet it will help as I've him pretty much always fed him the same. I think the is also a risk of dehydration if their pee is too dilute. But I'm not very good at working out the food side of things. Does anyone have any good suggestions for an elderly ham diet I can try to see if that helps or has been through this with an older dwarf ham and have a my good tips? Thanks!

[Pebbles82]

Aw little hector. I don't know about diet things I'm afraid, apart from softening food maybe. Dandelion root is supposed to a liver tonic, and for detoxifying the liver so the immune system works well (unlike the leaves that are a diuretic) - according to herbalists. Zooplus sell dandelion roots in a bag for hamsters - I give Charlie a small piece of one about once a week and he snaffles it straight away!

I got a free bag last time - and they last forever, so I can send you it if you want. No bugs in it because it's been in the freezer

I went to see a herbalist once who was also a GP when I was quite ill many years ago and she said herbalists always start with dandelion root because it's a safe herb and it helps clean the liver so everything else works better in the body. I was just looking up to see if I could find a quote about it and apparently it's been found effective for cancer now so might suggest my Mum tries it too.

I don't think the odd dandelion root would do any harm anyway and he'd probably enjoy it (if he has teeth of course!)

Dandelion leaves are diuretic though so maybe not a good idea if he's having urinary symptoms (although some say it helps).

This is the bag I have

100g JR Farm Dandelion Root + 50g Free| Free P&P £29+ at zooplus!

[velma]

Thanks serendipity. I think I'll stay away from anything that has a potential to even be a diuretic at the moment! I don't need to soften his food yet as teeth aren't gving him any problems - he's eating just fine, his usual greedy gannet self!
I seem to remember, but not sure where, reading an article that suggested reducing the protein quite a bit and upping intake of things like fruit. Poor Hector, he loves his mealworms so they'll have to be cut right down on...

[cypher]

Aww that's sad, I don't like to think of little Hector getting old, I know it's inevitable though, & I agree the changes in drinking & peeing are most likely just a sign that his kidneys don't work as well as they once did.
I would try & get his protein down a bit if you can, if you want any help with that I can try, for fluids you could try adding some baby food, mashed veg, things like potato, sweet potato or even swede, or a mix are often popular with elderly hams or just mash up any cooked veg he likes, fresh veg & fruit as well obviously if he enjoys them, maybe try him with some porridge too if you haven't already.
I would think unless things get really bad he'll probably manage his own hydration fairly well but no harm in helping out.
I would steer clear of any herbs, especially things like dandelion & nettle.

[Ceretrea]

Lowering the protein can help with kidney issues. If its bad you might notice that he gets a little wobbly. Elderly robos drink less in my experience so the fact he is drinking more does suggest an issue.

Find him a rabbit muesli if you can and you might have some success using a product like Activait which is licensed for cats and is just a palliative care supplement rather than a direct treatment. Something like Pronefra has shown improvements in mice but it varies as to whether your vet is happy to work out a dose.

For rats and mice though, I've had most success using a rabbit muesli for the oldies and since doing that have barely seen any kidney issues at all anymore.

[Pebbles82]

I guess it could be good to see a vet who might be able to rule out any infection or prescribe something, but this thread might help on the diet - it's actually for kidney failure but there are some general tips and dietary advice that might help as well.

Chronic Kidney Disease / Chronic Renal Failure: diagnosis, "treatment" options

I know herbs can't be given willy nilly, but if you did see the vet you could maybe ask if something like that would help. Rodipet actually make a "porridge" for liver, bladder and kidney that has milk thistle, nettle, dandelion root, willow bark and goldenrod in. I noticed the post above suggested milk thistle.

Although maybe it isn't appropriate for an older hamster, but they are meant to improve function, not just be diuretics and given in the right dose.

https://www.rodipet.de/shop/futter/z...ase-niere.html

[cypher]

I tried a couple of those Rodipet powder mixes Serendipity & no one would touch them! Can't say a thing about how helpful they might be but not so palatable I would imagine from my experience!

I would think given his size & age it would be better to just try a few small diet changes, unless you think it's serious enough to warrant either a vet trip or major changes velma, if he's always been fed pretty much the same thing it may be better at two not to make huge changes but just slight adjustments, maybe more grains & less of the higher protein foods.

[velma]

Thanks everyone!

Ceretrea, I'll pick up a small bag of rabbit muesli and gradually introduce a bit - I have a friend with a rabbit so if Hector doesn't like it, it won't go to waste. Good advice, I've not come across that before. He is a little wobbly but not hugely so and he still likes to take the route in his cage where he can clamber over things rather than the flat direct route so I don't think it's causing him an issue. He's still petty gung-ho

Serendipity, I came across that article. It's very interesting but very extensive! The food list was interesting I thought, about the potassium in foods.

As cypher said, I personally don't feel he needs, at this stage, a major upheaval. If I can tweak his diet and see even a small improvement then I'll know I'm on the right path. If not, then a vet trip is in order but I'm not sure at this stage in life how beneficial it would be if I can possibly avoid it.
I'll try gradually adding some mashed carby veg alongside the rabbit muesli to his diet and see how it goes.

[Pebbles82]

A tweak sounds good Yes it is very extensive ha ha! It is a bit worrying when they start looking a bit raggy round the edges. Charlie weighs a bit less and seems a bit thinner too but is also still very gung ho!

[flowerfairy]

Interesting about rabbit muesli. Any particular brand?