Homemade Hamster Mix - Page 2

cypher · 06-30-2017, 10:35 PM

Working out the proportions of each item is probably the most time consuming bit! A general rule is a ratio of 70:30 farinaceous seeds/grains to oily seeds/nuts, I find the overall fat percentage is too high though so tend to use less of the oily seeds in my mix.
Have you got the figures for fibre for your ingredients as that's quite important too.
I wouldn't put fenugreek in your mix, it's ok to feed a seed or a few sprouts now & then but mostly it should only be fed to diabetic hams due to it's hypoglycaemic properties.
I haven't been able to find nutritional info on grass seed either, in the end it didn't matter as my hams won't touch it anyway but most German mixes contain a fairly high proportion of grass seed so although you wouldn't be able to accurately calculate the overall nutrient values in your mix if you used it it is safe & healthy as a part of the mix.

Almi · 07-02-2017, 08:28 AM

Thanks for the insight cypher, it should be helpful in getting me started.

I'm honestly not concerned about the fiber content because I'm eliminating processed foods from the mix entirely, I plan to feed unlimited herbs and grasses, and they also get small tree branches. However if I really wanted to know the fiber content, I could look it all up.

I'm going to put a small enough amount of fenugreek into the mix so that they will only get a seed or two here and there. I don't see why it couldn't be fed regularly, IMHO. Healthy hamsters also benefit from stable blood sugar, do they not?

I'll try to formulate a mix and get back to you guys.

cypher · 07-02-2017, 08:44 AM

The odd fenugreek seed here & there should be ok but the idea of the whole diet when done correctly is to keep blood sugar levels stable & avoid unnecessary highs or lows but fenugreek has a hypoglycaemic action which can be very helpful with hyperglycaemic diabetic hams but it can lead to hypoglycaemia in healthy hams if you're not very careful.

Almi · 07-11-2017, 12:01 PM

Well, after spending way too much time on this, I've finally come down to a new mix. I researched, completely weighed out my options, spent a lot of time doing trial and error with mixing and seeing what I came up with for a GA. It wasn't until I finally started over again and just went with my gut and guessed...I finally came to the right percentages. Just needed a tiny bit of tweaking.

Here it is.

INGREDIENTS: Oats, Wheat, Triticale, Barley, Lentils, Buckwheat, Amaranth, Seed Mix (milo, corn, millet, sunflower seeds, calcium carbonate), Green Peas, Mung Beans, Quinoa, Fenugreek, Caraway, Soybeans, Brown Rice, Seed Mix (white millet, niger seed, canary grass seed, finch millet, red millet, sunflower chips, flax seed, calcium carbonate), Mealworms, Crickets, Hemp, Sunflower, Pumpkin, Walnut

GUARANTEED ANALYSIS: 18% protein, 5.8% fat

(I'll probably add in the fiber later.)

I have not bought some of these items yet, but part of weighing my options was comparing prices, so I kind of know how much this is going to cost. I'll let you guys know once I actually get to that part. (What I do know is that it's not going to break the bank.)

I had quite a large list of items initially, and then added more, and then I ended up paring it down quite a bit. Reasons for removing items from the list were: 1. they didn't have good fat/protein proportions, 2. they cost more than some other items but had the same nutritional value, or 3. they cost too much for what you're getting nutritionally. Another thing that made shopping around tricky was shipping. Some places seem cheap but then get you with shipping.

Good things about the mix: 1. Almost every single item is whole, raw, and sproutable. The triticale is flaked, the hemp is hulled, the walnuts are chopped, and obviously you can't sprout bugs. 2. Seven of the items are organic, I guess that's a win. One thing I noticed with organic items was that they seem to be more lacking in fat and protein than a lot of non-organic items.

Lastly, I want to remind that this will be fed alongside unlimited grass, herbs, and twigs/branches. Fresh fruits and vegetables are offered regularly, and I am also planning on keeping dried grasshoppers around for a high protein treat (they are way too expensive and large to add to the mix IMO).

As for the fenugreek, I still don't see what is so special about it, except it has a great fat/protein ratio! I'm really not sold on what you're telling me about it; to me it's just another seed, not a magical seed that is set apart from the others with its hypoglycemic properties. I imagine a lot of similar seeds work like that. I don't think they're going to mess up the blood sugar of a healthy hamster, especially as part of a balanced diet. Honestly that seems silly to me. Feel free to back up your claims with more info though; I'll surely read what you have to say. In any case, these seeds comprise 3.75% of the mixture.

Let me know what you guys think. I appreciate the help.

cypher · 07-11-2017, 10:44 PM

Did you do any research on fenugreek & how, when & why it's used?

Almi · 07-12-2017, 11:02 AM

Yes I did. It appears it is safe as a normal part of the diet, but obviously, like anything else, you don't want to eat too much. (Even so an overdose is usually not deadly.) I imagine a hamster would probably get sick of them before eating too much.

Otherwise, what I'm reading is all health benefits. I researched so I understood better how it works in the body, rather than just taking any one website's word on anything. The warning for it lowering blood sugar was for people who regularly have low blood sugar. Most resources also say that there's not enough evidence for a lot of the claims made about it, but generally the good seems to very much outweigh the bad for this item.

I also found several other seeds which have the same effect, like chia, flax, and coriander.

cypher · 07-12-2017, 10:32 PM

Of course fenugreek isn't the only food to have some hypoglycaemic effect but to my knowledge no other food or seed has been found to be effective in hams the way fenugreek is, it's your choice of course but personally I wouldn't want to take a risk & use something that is known to have a medicinal effect & is generally considered unsafe for healthy hamsters.
It's not always easy to apply research or anecdotal evidence in humans to hams so sometimes best to go on the experience of others who have tried & tested things over time with hams but that's entirely up to you.

Almi · 07-12-2017, 10:32 PM

If I buy everything in bulk (1-50 lb sizes), the mix comes to $1.20 per pound, which is about the same as the previous mix.

Almi · 07-12-2017, 10:35 PM

Honestly, from what I read it is more of a dietary supplement. It's a spice seed. Spice seeds should be used in small amounts, which is obvious because they're difficult to eat in large amounts. Lol. I'm not too worried about it.

Why is it generally considered unsafe for healthy hamsters? What evidence is there to support that?

cypher · 07-12-2017, 10:42 PM

As I explained it is considered unsafe for healthy hams due to the hypoglycaemic properties, you really don't want to use something which has that effect, other foods high in certain fibres for example can help slow the rate at which sugar is absorbed & that type of thing is safe & healthy but different to a hypoglycaemic, I don't have all my research readily to hand (too much of it to trawl through!) but if you have a look at info on diabetic hamsters it might make more sense to you.