First Time owner - And yes mine too are fighting : (

[Pompompoms]

Hi all, I have just joined and need some help with my lovely little Roborovskis

I got two boys last week from Pets at Home, one Jam is an Agouti colouring, and the other The Cloud is pure white all over. They are brothers, they are nine weeks old, and the cutest things, I absolutely adore them!

I took the advice of Pets at Home and purchased a Spelos cage for them which from reading on here doesn't see like it was the best advice. When I spoke to them today though and voiced my concerns, they did reiterate the cage should be fine for dwarfs. Seemingly they have a different opinion from everyone here!

For the first four days all was well, they ran in the wheel together, played together, shared the tunnel food, tubes, toys, everything. They snuggled up and slept together all day, and were really happy and great friends. They have been great being handled, super fast of course, but are already happy to sit on my hand and groom too.

Sunday night (I got them last Tuesday) they started scrapping a bit, not too bad, no squeaking, just a tussle then off again. This has escalated over the last few days to pretty much every waking moment they are near eachother. They don't really fight over anything, they just have to be near, occasionally they will still hop in the wheel together though and have a run, or sit and eat together.

The fights have been getting more and more frantic and vicious with much more squeaking. Tonight even out of the cage they were going for eachother as soon as they caught sight of eachother.

The only thing they are still doing together is sleeping where they snuggle together and look like little pompoms!

Blood was drawn tonight on the Cloud's nose so I took Jam out (to be honest they are as bad as eachother it was just a questions of who got hurt first). He is in a tub with bedding a house food and water for the night in the bath so he can't come to any harm if he escapes.

I just didn't want them hurting eachother anymore while I sleep.

When I told pets at home about the fighting today (before the blood) they said if in a week they are still at it I could bring them back and they'd sell them separately. I explained there was no way I wanted to give them back as i love them, I just wanted advice on what to do. This is when I asked about the cage again. They did say if they bleed then to get two wheels, but I'd rather keep them seperate while The Cloud heals.

So do you think it's the cage? If so having being advised wrongly do I have a good case to ask for a different one?

Are they going to have to live apart now?

Is it just an age sexual maturity thing?

How should I reintroduce them?

I'm taking them in tomorrow (in seperate boxes!) so The Cloud can see the Vet they have in house, and that I can bring up the cage issue AGAIN!!!


Any tips for what i should say, for helping out my unhappy Robos??

Thanks

[ellisyellis]

hi,

ow my god is all i can say realy! yes that cage is far too small for a pair of robo's! that will be the most likely reason why they are fighting. they are the same as us and if they are under each others feet they WILL fall out. dwarf hamsters can fall out even when housed in the best cages available but stuck in that together a fight is just weighting to happen realy. personaly i think you should send a written complaint to pets at home head quarters as your ham has been injured from you being advised to buy a cage far to small. if they where my new pets i would not be happy as after all you asked for advise. i doubt they will give you a new cage but you may get a refund on the cage you bought as it was sold to you wrongly. its the miss sale of goods. they told you it could do a job it cant and under the sales of goods act thats not allowed. i wouldnt bother talking to the staff in the shop because you will probably get a spotty kid fresh from school! but it you wright to them they have to read it. address it as a complaint.

next is sorting out the problem!

you have two choices i would say. either get a much bigger cage and try re introducing them or buy another cage for the one in your bath tub.

if you want to re introduce them i think its best to do it sooner rather than later so they are still young hams. i have also been considering a pair of dwarfs and this is what i have learnt. you need two of everything. two houses to sleep in, two wheels, 2 bowls or scatter the food out and maybe two water bottles. this is to avoid them being territorial. next you need to go for a cage which is flat and has lots of floor space and not levels and built in tunnels as this can also make them territorial as they may scrap over areas. i have been looking at the ferplast duna multy. this cage seems ideal. also you can get an even bigger one called the ferplast maxi duna. just make sure its the new style with smaller gaps on the roof bars. if you want more advice on putting them back together im sure people will help you out as ive never actually done it and people on here have.

option two is get another cage and keep them seperate. the cage you have at the moment could house one robo on its own but its certianly not spacious. ask others about that. i think it would be ok for one. if you buy another cage and keep them seperate just remember to either get a tank style cage or a cage with smaller bar spaces. also try to go for a bigger one than the cage you have if you can.

good luck and keep us up to date on how your hams are. im sure you will get more help and advice from other people aswell. x

[loyal_tree]

Most of the people working at pet shops are grossly misinformed unfortunately. I would take the advice of educated members on this forum over any pet store employee any day! ellisyellis has given you some great information, and I won't repeat what everything she said. The cage is too small, you need multiples of everything, and avoid cages with tubes and separate spaces. They need a large flat area with two wheels. The Duna Multy is a great cage and has gotten many good reviews.

Don't split them into separate cages yet, try a new cage ASAP and get them another wheel. Robo's are social and usually do better in pairs or groups then alone. If they have only been apart for a day or two, reintroduction should be no problem. Put most of the bedding from the other cage into the new cage and both of their smells will be on it and will help with reintroduction and reduce stress for the cage switch.

[Pompompoms]

Thank you so much for the replies and advice, I went in today and got them checked over as well as buying a much bigger cage with two of everything. I have kept the other cage, and am now glad I did as I might have to use it now.

It all started off well, they spent eight hours cuddled up asleep together, then for the first two hours played well together and I thought phew it's going to be ok.

Well it's not looking too good, they started squabbling again then fighting and I noticed that Jam has a cut on his back from tonight and a little cut on his foot. I think it's looking like they might have to be split but I really didn't want them to live on their own. I guess for their safety they might have to. Two injuries in two days isn't good and I'm slightly reluctant to go to bed tonight and leave them to it

Oh, and what they seem to be fighting about it the wheel. They have two wheels exactly the same, but they both only want to go in the same one *sigh*. I got Jam out the cage and held him by the scruff so I could have a good look at him and the cut. It seems very surface level, the blood is all dried and he didn't repond at all when I touched around it so it might have even happened earlier.

I forgot to add, Jam was the smallest of the litter and one of his back legs isn't quite right, you wouldn't know the speed he moves around, but it seems shorter as he holds it up when he's still and doesn't always walk on it. The Cloud is much bigger and I think being a bit of a bully.

[ellisyellis]

hi,

your doing all the right things so hopefully it will work out. i guess you have to make the decision whether they are putting each others health at risk from being together. its not nice to get injurys. if they are fighting for the same wheel maybe try moving that wheel to a different place in the cage?? i dont realy know what else you could try. keep us up dated on how they go, take care x

[loyal_tree]

Sounds like the injuries have been minor so far. It's totally up to you, but I'd let them go together for awhile longer. They could still be stressed from the new cage and all the new things that have been happening to them lately. Hamsters are creatures of habit, and disruptions in their little lives are big deals.

There is a 'quality of life' factor to consider, so if you feel it's too much for the little one, then go ahead and split them. Like I said, I might give it some more time. Sometimes you just have to hold your nerve. I have a pair that fought for a couple of weeks, and there were minor injuries. I decided to wait it out a bit and seems they have 'made up' and get along quite well again surprisingly.

[souffle]

Tammy at Oak Farm is very experienced with Robos. Have a read at her website info here
http://www.oakfarmrabbitsandrodents.co. ... /main.html
PM her if you need further help

[Pompompoms]

Thanks again for the tips, I would be absolutely at a loss without this forum and all the knowledge on here!

Well I decided to seperate them for the night, really because I've had 10 hours sleep in the last 48 hours due to keeping an eye on the fighting.

I woke up this morning to them fighting which is when they are usuallt asleep. They slept all day at different ends of the cage then come eight when they normally get up nothing at all, they both stayed sleeping till about ten. I think they're absolutely shattered with everything that's been going on!

When the did come out Jam was playing but holding his bad leg up, I got him out and his foot is pretty swollen and cut, plus he has a cut on his back and just underneath on his bits ouch! The cloud didn't really come out for anything other than a slow walk about thaen a flying attack at Jam, that was all he did all night. He didn't seem quite right either, very quiet apart from the attacking. He's not doing anything in the cage I've put him in either, very strange given that he normally spends about four hours a night wheeling!

Jam ended up looking frightened and unhappy, he was shaking every time The cloud came out then just got beaten up again.

I really feel that his injuries need to heal, and he needs to settle. I am going to try and get them happily living together again, tomorrow I'm going to go out and get what i need to split the cage, and take a lot of time getting them used to eachother that way (hopefully).

Foer tonight though it's seperate cages, healing injuries and confidence, and sleep for me!

[Bunsey]

what a shame. It seems, from skim-reading this thread, that the poor knowledge of the staff at the pet shop has caused the trouble between your lads. The Spelos cage is a total joke for 2 robos. Even putting aside the fact that it is far too small for even one robo, the sinlge wheel and the tubes are a definate no-no for a pair. What is the cage you bought for them the 2nd time? Personally, i recommend the Savic Rody. What size wheels did you buy for them? I would recommend the silent spinner, because it does allow 2 robos to run together if they wish.

Does the new cage have any tubes in it? If so, take them out. Set up the cage so that they only have a nest (with more than one exit), the 2 wheels and the food scattered on the floor (no bowl) and the water bottle of course. If possible, fix 2 water bottles.

I don't know if, having been separated, you will be able to put them back together. Most people would say no, but before i knew what i was doing, i separated a pair overnight and then just plonked them back together (into the cage of the submissive - never put the submissive into the cage of the dominant) and they were fine. The longer you leave it though, the less chance of putting them back together. You can also try re-introducing them in a box or tub instead of the cage, holding a grid between them and seeing what happens when they sniff each other through this... obviously if they try to fly at each other through the grid, the re-intro isn't going to work. You could try split cage (info of this is on the page that Souffle has linked to above) if nothing else works, but i doubt it will work to be honest, if they just try to attack each other. It's never worked for me. They've always either gone straight together (using tub and grid-holding method) or not gone together at all, no matter how long i've done the split cage method.

[ellisyellis]

ouch! i would say if ones getting injured that often then they need to live apart. maybe keep them close ao they can see each other threw their cages. bit sad that all this has happened but given the wrong advice you where given and a already weak hamster it was doomed from the start realy. pets at home shouldnt of sold you a hamster with a bad leg. if a pair is going to work then they need to start of equal and they were not due to injury. just another pets at home horror story. im realy going off that pet shop rapidly! x