Tortoiseshell/Tortoiseshell and White

[Edgar_Furrybutt]

Ok, I know I asked a while back about how you go about getting tortoiseshell hamsters. I ran into something tonight and needed clarification.

I read that the yellow gene is a sex linked gene. So, if you breed a black female to a yellow male, all of the resulting yellows from the litter would be male and all the tortoiseshells would be females. So, if you bred a black male to a yellow female, would you get black males (since the yellow gene is sex linked and the mom was yellow and tortoiseshell males are really rare) and yellow or tortoiseshell females? Or would you have black males and just yellow females?

And to get the Calico/Tortoiseshell and White, you would need to breed a banded hamster, I know, but would the mom be a black banded and the dad a yellow? Or could you do a yellow mom and black banded dad? Is there such a thing as a yellow banded (I've never seen pics of one)

Sorry for all of the questions. I've decided when I start breeding hamsters again, I'll focus on tortoiseshells, calicos and doves. It'll be a while though.

[Vectis Hamstery]

In summary, sex linked means the yellow gene is on the X chromosome. Female hamsters have two X chromosomes, and males have one X and one Y. A yellow female has two yellow genes, one on each X. A tort has one yellow gene on one X and none on the other. A male has only one X chromosome therefore can only be yellow or non yellow (unless he has a more complicated genetic make up e.g. XXY). Male hamsters have to inherit the X from their mother as they get the Y from their father (as females don't have a Y) which helps in determining outcomes.

In your questions, black female to yellow male - all females will be torts (as mum has only non yellow genes to give the girls, and dad has only yellow ones) and boys non yellow with the colour depending on what other genes the parents carry (as mum has only non yellow genes to give, and they boys inherit their X from mum as I mentioned). Black is a recessive colour so the yellow parent would need to carry it to have black pups, if there are no shared recessives then the pups would be golden and golden torts.

Yellow female to non-yellow male means all males will be yellow (remember they have to inherit their X from mum, and she has only yellow genes to give) and all females will be tort.

Banded is separate to the yellow gene and is dominant, therefore a hamster only needs one copy to show a band. Either parent can be banded and half of the offspring would have bands. You can't guarantee that the it would be the torts that have the bands though! There is such a thing as a yellow banded.

I would suggest you have a look at some resources on hamster genetics such as hamsterlopaedia or Genetics and Inheritance
There is a table on the website which explains the answers to both questions.

[Edgar_Furrybutt]

Awesome thank you

[Edgar_Furrybutt]

I just got a chance to look at that website and it talks about breeding brother and sister together and father to daughter. That's not typically recommended right? Especially if you don't know the line?

[Vectis Hamstery]

It is not usually done, and if any degree of inbreeding were attempted it would be with thorough pedigrees by experienced breeders. Under the heading 'further crosses' it explains:

(Please note; these matings do not necessarily have to be incestuous;* all that is necessary would be that the hamsters in the pairings had the appropriate genotype.* Also, the ratios of each colour expected are just that; the ratios expected.* Individual results will vary, but over many such matings the ratios will hold true).

[shell1805]

just to throw my two pence worth in, my fudge (tortie) had a black mum and a yellow dad. all boys were black and girls tortie xxx

[vanilla-yazoo]

I second everything vectis has said, I have had a yellow male (my sig) he wasnt displaying great yellow colour, but geneticly was yellow, I was going to breed him to nancy (also in sig) for gold tort, and rex (seporate genes again) but that was cancelled, and he lost his health

The chart was only to show how the genes work, you wouldnt breed that way unless its a breeder who has brought in a pair into this country of a new colour, so they are trying to get as many of that colour as possible, then breed the children/grand children to our colours to help pass the colour further along with no more in breeding (say great great grandparents may be related on the other sides of the pedigree, my dianna has the same great grand father twice, as he was a show winner, Not sure if it was intentional, but that far back its not like breeding the same gene pool)

you could use a black/ black banded to a yellow male from a previous black tort litter, he would carry the black and yellow, and the double black would make the torts.

Banded and dom spot can both be merged with tort, making very pretty babys