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Old 09-03-2018, 01:16 AM   #11
Razor
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Default Re: Cage Flooding

Since you'd specifically mentioned the Humane Society of the United States of America, I felt compelled to actually read up on the information posted on their website. They recommend a minimum of 2 square feet of floor space for a wire cage, which translates to about 60.96cm by 30.48cm. Given that you say your cage is 64cm by 31cm, I think it's almost exactly the minimum recommended size listed here. Further, in addition to what mehrfarbig, mangoandmimi and cypher have said, here's a paragraph from the website of the HSUSA:
Size it up
In the wild, hamsters have separate chambers in their burrows for sleeping, eating, and eliminating, and they tend to observe the same customs in their cages. One corner will be the bathroom, another will serve as the pantry for storing food stashes, and another will be his bedroom.

Room to spread out (and to burrow and nest) is important. When selecting a cage, keep in mind that your hamster will spend most of his time in this contained space. Bigger is better when it comes to hamster housing!

You can find the link here for your reference.
What I'm trying to emphasize on here is that a cage size that is recommended as the minimum is not necessarily the appropriate one. Often times pet stores and pet suppliers try to push on unsuitable cages, either out of lack of right knowledge or in an attempt to indirectly force new pet owners to spend more. Good cage alternatives can be extremely inexpensive if you consider something like a bin cage (IKEA Samla for instance).

I hope you are able to sort it out and have a wonderful adventure with your little girl!
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Old 09-03-2018, 02:00 AM   #12
Pebbles82
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Default Re: Cage Flooding

I agree that the bottle behaviour is/was a sign of stress - repetitive behaviour getting your attention. They are clever little things and they do try and tell us when something is wrong and in this case it really is a lack of space and enrichment and the wheel too small (which can cause them backache or spinal problems if it carried on too long).

Syrian hamsters need a lot more space. Hammies also need a lot of enrichment to be able to have normal behaviours so they're happy Enrichment means - plenty of substrate, so they can bury hoards and dig in it and move it about - a house that's large enough to build a large cosy nest in. A level (which you have), toys such as a tube at floor level or tied to the cage - variety and things to do basically.

It is very hard to find a suitable sized cage for a syrian hamster in the US and a lot of people make bin cages for that reason or convert a detolf into a tank (if there is enough space for one) or get a 40 gallon breeder tank which is about the right size for a syrian. There are two or three cages which are ideal for Syrian hamsters - not too big, not too small - but they both cost over $100. (The Lixit Mickey 2XL which is sold on Amazon for about $120 to $130 and the Marchioro Goran which you can get for about $100). Also both of those will allow an 11" wheel to fit in easily.

There are a number of suitable wheel options in the US - there's the wodent wheel, The Carolina Storm Wheel (10" bucket wheel) and the 12" Silent Runner (that's Runner not Spinner ). Also the silent spinners have had issues in the last couple of years and some of them just don't spin - so if the wheel is too small or not spinning properly she won't be able to use it and will be trying to alert you.

It's a total pain when you get sold a cage that isn't big enough for a syrian hamster. Had the same thing myself. Some people manage to take it back for a refund - depending on how long you've had it.

I have the UK version of the Lixit Mickey 2XL for our Roborovski dwarf hamster (it's exactly the same just labelled Savic instead of Lixit) and he has a 9" wheel in there - plus plenty of floor toys - just to give an example of a cage set up Also have a look at the "Let's see your cages" thread for ideas on cages and set ups.

One option could be - if you can't get a refund - to make a bin cage and keep the existing cage as a play cage for when you do a clean out. Although clean outs is another thing people get given information about that isn't that good. Weekly full clean outs aren't necessary and can cause a lot of stress to a hamster. It's better to just "spot clean" the substrate infrequently and then only do partial clean outs infrequently. You can go a couple of months without a substrate change with a larger cage and more substrate in there (which also saves on substrate overall) particularly if your hammy has a litter tray. They will use a litter tray if you put one in the area they choose to pee Most people put chinchilla bathing sand in it. You then just empty the litter tray every 5 days or so and the rest of the cage stays clean mostly (although they do tend to pee in the wheel sometimes).

So a partial clean would be - substrate one week - but cleaning the wheel a different week and any toys etc a different week again. That way something always smells familiar. And keeping things in the same place. Hammies scent mark their cage partly so it's their familiar territory and partly to find their way around (they dont see well so follow their scent trails). So it's less stressful for them if something still smells familiar after a partial clean. Even when changing the substrate, I tend to replace a bit of the old clean substrate (eg sprinkle it on top) so it doesn't all smell completely different.

They need at least 3 to 4" depth of substrate - the more the better really - some hamsters will dig tunnels with more - others arent bothered but like to burrow down in it or bury their hoards under their nest. So another way they can have normal behaviours is if they have a house that is open underneath and sat on top of the substrate - then they tend to bury the hoards under their nest and snack in bed

When they're able to have normal behaviours they are really very clean and keep their house tidy and use a toilet Although it's important not to completely remove their hoard and nest when doing a clean out or they can start peeing on the hoard to deter people stealing it. So best to always leave the dry hoard unless it is pee'd on or taking over and needs pruning - if it's pee'd on and needs removing then try and leave a bit of the old hoard that's dry and add new food as well in exactly the same place. They get very precious about their hoard and their nest. Same with the nest. I usually leave it unless it's pee'd in or replace a bit of the old dry nest that smells familiar if it has been pee'd in. Then put a big heap of torn up strips of plain white toilet paper somewhere in the cage so they can forage for it and rebuild the nest.

Sorry if you know all this! I also find a much smaller water bottle works well for hammies - a mouse sized 75ml bottle is fine - the water needs changing every day or two anyway

It's all a learning curve - I learned the hard way! But our hamster led the way - he became aggressive and depressed in a small cage and you could almost see him smiling when we upgraded him and his behaviour was completely different.

Added some photos of bin cages and the Lixit Mickey 2XL. The second photo was when it was set up for our Syrian hamster with an 11" wheel. The round plastic hanging things are rat sputniks. I think they're called Lixit critter space pods in the US. Its like a plastic hammock - they work well next to shelf as it's another place to go and hang out Rat sized toys are better for Syrians as most toys sold for hamsters are too small or the entrance holes are too small and only any good for dwarf hamsters. But you can make toys easily and cardboard is always good - a kitchen roll inner tube slit down one side (so it expands) or a tissue box as an extra hidey place eg. Or a cardboard egg box.

Have also linked the two cages but it they're out of budget then a bin cage can be a cheap option or a second hand fish tank. Petco also do dollar per gallon sales regularly which is how people get a 40 gallon breeder tank for $40

Bin cages

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ha...w=1047&bih=462

Lixit Mickey 2XL - reviews are helpful

https://www.amazon.com/Lixit-Animal-...70_&dpSrc=srch

Marchioro Goran 82 (not 72) (hard to find at a good price)

https://www.petmountain.com/product/...-rat-cage.html

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Last edited by Pebbles82; 11-27-2022 at 06:41 PM.
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Old 09-03-2018, 02:08 AM   #13
Pebbles82
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Default Re: Cage Flooding

It is very annoying that cages that are too small are manufactured and sold - they may have a purpose but not as a full time home for any species of hamster or rat! Even if a hamster has a lot of out of cage time or free roams - it is at night when they need the space as that is when they are most active and use their wheel most for exercise. The wheel needs to be big enough that they can run with a straight back - 10" to 12" wheels are the most popular. They also run much better in a larger wheel.

Unfortunately there is no real legislation on small pet cage sizes and the onus is on the owner to provide suitable welfare while the cage manufacturers make big profits.
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Old 09-03-2018, 11:04 AM   #14
flowerfairy
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Default Re: Cage Flooding

I had a hamster who loved to bar chew. I upgraded her to the barney from zooplus (100 x 54cm) and wove cardboard through the bars. She would shed the cardboard in amfew minutes.

I also hid food in an egg box so that she had to break in to find it!

I hope you are able to work out a good solution that your hamster and you are both happy with,
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