I think I separated them for too long

alpacassei · 02-13-2017, 05:59 PM

Stephano and Francisco had to be separated for 2 hours while Stephano was at the vets. They were fine before then but now Francisco is missing almost an entire ear.

They haven't acted aggressive towards eachother since and they were sharing food just now so I'm not sure if Francisco irritated Stephano (he's been really itchy and sore from his dry skin and the vet visit stressed him out a bit) and Stephano bit him but I'm worried they'll need separating.

I've removed any items from their cage where they can corner eachother and I've prepared a bin cage if they need separating.

AmityvilleHams · 02-13-2017, 06:21 PM

Separate them.Once you've had hamsters separated for any period of time(even a few minutes),you should never keep them together again

Take this as an experience to learn from.

cypher · 02-13-2017, 10:25 PM

It's not just the length of time they were apart, Stephano would smell very different coming back from the vets & Francisco may not have recognised him immediately, they might settle down again but do keep a very close watch in case they fight again.
If one of a pair has to go to the vet it's often a good idea to take both together.

souffle · 02-14-2017, 01:03 AM

You need to separate them. Please just do it. The poor skin may be due to stress. It is not fair to keep them together at this stage if he has now lost a whole ear. You cannot monitor them 24/7 and even if you could his mental health is equally as important as his physical as they impact on each other. Two males would not live together in a natural situation. Groups would be mixed sexes and ages.
Sometimes when they are a lot older re intros are possible but they need to be alone for now. They should settle in about 10 days.

alpacassei · 02-14-2017, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cypher

It's not just the length of time they were apart, Stephano would smell very different coming back from the vets & Francisco may not have recognised him immediately, they might settle down again but do keep a very close watch in case they fight again.

I think that's what it was. The vet thinks Stephano's allergic to the mites they naturally have so he was given some drops so he would've smelt like the vets and his medication. I'm guessing what happened is Francisco thought there was a new hamster in his cage and tried to fight him and Stephano fought back and bit his ear.

I've been watching them closely and they haven't fought since and they're not acting territorial towards each other.

Francisco's ear (the half that's left) is swollen and sore but it's not infected and it hasn't been bleeding which is good. I've cleaned it with warm boiled salt water (like you use to clean piercings).

Even if they don't start fighting, I'll separate them anyway if Francisco's ear isn't healing properly.

cypher · 02-14-2017, 09:12 AM

It wouldn't be an actual allergy to the mites, those mites live on them all the time it's only when their immune system is compromised that the mites cause a problem, this can be due to many things but is often stress related so it may be as well to separate them.
Giving a little brewers yeast can sometimes help a bit, only a tiny amount, either crushed tablets or flakes & I would still give the flax & epo we discussed in your other thread to help his skin heal & stay in good condition.

alpacassei · 02-14-2017, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cypher

It wouldn't be an actual allergy to the mites, those mites live on them all the time it's only when their immune system is compromised that the mites cause a problem, this can be due to many things but is often stress related so it may be as well to separate them.
Giving a little brewers yeast can sometimes help a bit, only a tiny amount, either crushed tablets or flakes & I would still give the flax & epo we discussed in your other thread to help his skin heal & stay in good condition.

He hadn't been acting stressed, so I don't think it's that (the only time he was stressed was after I gave him the drops which I think is what caused him to act aggressive towards Francisco).

I haven't been able to get the flaxseed and epo yet, I've been stuck in bed with the flu and I was so tired and sick that I forgot about it when I took Stephy to the vets yesterday

I'm picking it up tomorrow though. Do you think giving some to Franny would help his ear heal?

alpacassei · 02-14-2017, 12:56 PM

I have a week off form uni so I'm able to watch them all day this week. If there's any sign either of them are stressed or fighting I'll separate them immediately.

Should I give Francisco the mite medicine too to stop him passing them onto Stephano?

AmityvilleHams · 02-14-2017, 01:25 PM

Medicine should never be given without a veterinarian approving of it.Such medicines can be extremely damaging to the health of otherwise healthy hamsters who have no need for it,so it would be far too dangerous to risk

Separate them now instead of waiting.You've already got more than enough reason to,so don't wait until it's more obvious that they're not doing well together or they end up injuring each other even worse.

Pebbles82 · 02-14-2017, 04:02 PM

I agree with the others. You need to separate them now and not wait. Once an injury has occurred from fighting, the next fight could leave one of them horribly maimed or dead. There have been some pretty horrific injuries from dwarf hamster fights with half a face missing or eyes hanging out of their sockets - then the maimed hamster has to be put to sleep. The second fight will be worse than the first. If it was just a bit of squabbling then yes you could monitor them and see if they settle down, but an ear injury has occurred and that is a sign that things can get much worse very quickly. It's a bit like the old thing of one a dog has drawn blood they become dangerous.

Stress can show in different ways. They don't need to act stressed, to feel stressed - if that makes sense. Sadly they do need to live separately from now on.

No don't give the mite medicine to your other hammy. It is pretty strong stuff. As Cypher mentioned, mites live on them naturally, but become prolific when they are ill or run down (or under stress as that depletes the immune system too).

Separating them should help prevent the spread of the mites as well, and your other hammy may not get them anyway if he has a stronger immune system at the moment. Finish the course of mite treatment given for the hammy it was given for and then take it from there. It's an ideal time to separate them anyway or you would have needed to clean everything in the cage - so putting him in a new cage or tank with clean things means you start out without him being reinfected from bedding or toys. You'll probably need to do a cage clean on the current cage as well (the one the hammy without mites is in).

It's a shame, but it is very common for pairs to fall out, especially after a change of some kind. Do you have a spare cage? If not a plastic storage bin would do temporarily, with the lid off, until you get chance to make it into a bin cage or find another cage (there are some good second hand deals on ebay or you can get a Duna Multy for about £33).

Cage Duna Multy