New hamsters, sleep and fighting.

[alipali1]

So on Wednesday I go two male roborovski dwarf hamsters. I've only ever had syrian hamsters before.
The guy in the shop said they were 8 weeks old.
Firstly they sleep A LOT, I know they sleep well but I mean nightly they are up for about 3 hours max and go back to sleep until the next day, I know with the move etc they are probably a little extra stressed and nervous but is this okay?

Another thing we were told to be brepared that as they get to adulthood they could start to fight so we bought 2 cages that at the moment are connected together but can be separated if needs be.
We were advised to buy 2 of each item as this can stop them fighting.
In the few days we've had them they have had some little scraps but nothing to crazy and not blood or squealing (we were told they will screach if it's bad) are they play fighting or is this just the start?
The smaller one tends to hide a lot and doesn't come out as much, his brother is a lot bigger than his, do you think he is scared?

I don't want to separte them yet in case they are fine and just exploring etc as once they are apart there's no going back, does anyone have any advice for me please?

[Cinnamon Bear]

After they settle in you should see them more. It's impossible to know what is the extent of the relationship you can have with them until some time goes by. About the smaller one hiding in the corner, you should have 2 food dishes or scatter feed. You should have 2 wheels and 2 hidey huts and no levels. What kind of cage do you have them in, the dimensions?

Hopefully they will be able to keep them together but it's good you bought an extra cage in case there is a falling out. They can fall out even in a year from now. Always have to keep an eye on them. Good luck with your new babies.

Do you have names of photos of them yet?

[cypher]

They may need more time to settle before they become more active although robos are usually busy little hams, two cages joined could give rise to cause them to become territorial & actually increase the risk of fights breaking out.
My main concern is the difference in size, the bigger one will be the more dominant one & may prevent the smaller one from getting enough food, as CB said scatter feeding (& plenty of it) can help but keep a close eye on them, even if they don't fight the smaller one may not thrive if they stay together.

[AmityvilleHams]

Separate as soon as possible.It isn't natural to be in same-sex groups anyways,and there really isn't any reason to take a chance with the health(mental and physical)of any animal.

Modular cages aren't suitable for any hamster,especially pairs as they can make fighting and such even more likely along with the use of leveled cages and any sort of platform in a cage.Cages don't have to be too massive for a robo,but it would still need to be on one single surface without interruption(so no tubes etc)to actually count as having the full amount of floor space where you'll get modular cages which are merely a few hundred square inches or so.

Luckily you can get a suitable alternative cage for a single robo very cheaply,something around the 60 cm x 30 cm to 70 cm x 40 cm range would be ideal.Storebought cages will generally be pricier than something like a simple bin cage of that size,but there are definitely some good options for storebought robo cages.

Cage Duna Multy
Cage Mini Duna Multy
Genus 300 Starter
Kora Mouse Cage

Some are a bit on the smaller end but still manageable in size for a robo.It is much cheaper to buy a suitable spare cage rather than have unsuitable modular cages,along with the issue of how expensive vet bills would be if one or both hamsters were ill or seriously injured because of fighting Plus,if a hamster or both hamsters ended up dying during a fight,they can't exactly be replaced.

[alipali1]

Thanks for the replies guys!

This is the set up I have, I know it's not the best size etc but we were impatient and only went for a browse and got carried away, before we knew it we'd bought the hammies as we fell in love with them both! We plan to upgrade asap and wanted to see how they were together as we were planning on making our own cage set up, we've seen a lot of amazing homemade ones on YouTube and are exciting so am really hoping they'll be okay together.

Oh I thought being able to have their own space would be good, so is this not the best way to go?
You can't tell in the photo the size difference too well but they haven't been up and amount much and especially not at the same time.
They do sleep together so assume they aren't too aggravated by each other yet.
I could be over paranoid here as I've only ever had one at a time but wanted to ask.
Yeah they currently have 2 bowls and we scatter food and there are a few different chew toys around. The water we had 2 but the other leaked so bad the entire cage got wet so there's only one at the moment but plan to go and exchange it as it came with the cage.

The wheel we did have 2 but they would only use the left one and not the right, they'd rather both run together that use the other so we removed it to make more room and add an extra house for hiding.

The smaller one just prefers to hide in bed, maybe he's just lazy like me? He seems fine and when he eventually comes out he isn't too nervous he does explore and use the toys etc but just hope he's not hiding because he's scared.

Yeah they have names smaller guy is Castiel and larger guy is Nanakai


I really would like to separate as a last resort, I know you say they don't mind being solitary but if they can have a nice life together as a pair I'd much rather that.

[cypher]

You don't need to separate immediately, some pairs will do fine together & robos often better than russian hams so there is a chance they'll be ok but you do need to keep a close eye on them & be prepared.

Having their own space gives them something to protect which is why it could lead to fights, this goes for houses, levels & anything else they can claim as their own, not just the two cages.
Usually smaller cages are better for a pair, at least to begin with for this reason.
You do need two wheels though & houses should have more than one exit so one ham can't trap the other, it can be difficult to find the right houses but bendy bridges with lots of shredded plain white toilet tissue for nesting & plenty of substrate underneath are fine.
I wouldn't assume too much from them sleeping together, they will often continue to do that after fighting.
The smaller one will be more nervous being the more submissive ham so just keep a close eye on him for now. It's hard to see in that photo just how much of a size difference there is.
If fights do escalate it's better to separate sooner rather than wait for injuries as they can escalate rapidly once they start.

[AmityvilleHams]

Having a nice life together as a pair is extremely unlikely,especially if they're already potentially going to fight Solitary living isn't what all humans want for their pets,but since they'd have even better lives living alone it isn't a matter of reducing their quality of life.If anything,keeping them together reduces their quality of life even more.

That aside,just make the cages not attached and keep one hamster to a cage.It may seem awful at first,but it is far kinder to take action now than to have not done anything later and risk it becoming far worse.Upgrade in the future though,but for now focus on the biggest priority which is making them separate.

[alipali1]

Thanks guys, I'll see how they go tonight and decide from there, they've been out a couple of times today and no fighting so far so fingers crossed.

I know pet shop workers tell fibs here and there but I was told by a girl that she's seen many successful pairings with them so a girl can hope!

I will try and put the other wheel in then and see but for the last 2 days it's been untouched and they just go together at the same time haha, quite funny to watch.
I have a bendy bridge hous, that's what they slept in at the shop so I tried to keep it a little similar. They have a plastic house with has a door and a large window so should be able to get out and not trapped?
And we have a little teepee house with only has one exit but it's. It only big enough for one so is this okay?

Well on the first day it was the smaller one bugging the larger one, the bigger one wasn't seen picking on him but they keep sniffing each other and chasing.

As unlikely as it may be I would like to give them the chance to get used to their new environment a little first, it's all new and must be scary for them, and with moving stuff l around a bit here and here to see what works best/leaking the new smells must be annoying and confusing. If I see any trouble tonight we may just separate them tomorrow

[AmityvilleHams]

The teepee could let the hamster inside get trapped,so no it wouldn't be okay just because it's only big enough for one.Houses must have at least two entrances with pairs,so that there is always an alternative exit just in case.

Separating them tomorrow if there is any trouble could mean you wait too long and end up with an injured hamster.Don't waste time with separation,the consequences as mentioned can be severe.

Even though there have been successful pairings that doesn't mean it is truly beneficial for the hamsters involved,nor does it mean there isn't a greater risk of the hamsters being constantly in a state of fear that is negatively impacting them.

It's even harder for them to get calm and used to a new environment when there is constant elevated stress.At the end of the day this is not something to toy around with,and if you take it lightly or don't react fast enough it will end badly.

[Cinnamon Bear]

They are so cute, that big one is a chubby little thing
I like their names too