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Old 07-06-2015, 01:30 PM   #11
Pebbles82
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

It does sound like she doesn't like the lid being taken off above her. Does it make a noise?
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Old 07-07-2015, 03:23 AM   #12
Leila0420
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

Hi Oatmeal_Cupcake I think I'm going to join everyone in saying that maybe the detolf is not the best cage for such a nervy hamster like your Aria. Although I'm with Piebald in thinking that swapping her and Little Bear's cage around might not be such a good idea because it will smell like him and that could be fairly unsettling for her. If she was used to being in an opaque bin cage the clear glass of the Detolf might be making her feel very exposed. As an intermediate measure could you possibly drape a blanket/ towel round the majority of the cage or put large pieces of cardboard around the edge so that she isn't visible from the outside?

This also reminded me a little bit of Agent Spectacles thread. He's obviously another nervy ham that doesn't like being picked up so his owners built him some platforms so that if he wants to come out for play time he can climb up and make the decision whether to come out or not himself... (Agent Spectacles Thread) Maybe you could make her something that leads into the playpen you want to use and she if she adventures out in her own time?

Last edited by Leila0420; 07-07-2015 at 03:28 AM.
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Old 07-07-2015, 09:02 AM   #13
Oatmeal_Cupcake
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

So sorry I didn't come back to reply some more yesterday. I got caught up with work, one thing led to another and by the time I remembered that I forgot replying I was already in bed. So very sorry for being disrespectful!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbarker View Post
I think it's really good of you to respect Aria in not forcing her to come out and play, some hamsters are just more reclusive it doesn't make you any less of a good owner it's just her personality. I still stand by moving her out of the detolf, put her out of her misery. It's clear she doesn't like being exposed in large open spaces. In regards to her getting scared when you lift the lid I don't think it's because she knows it's time for playtime, I think it's because she's hearing this noise coming from above and put yourself in her shoes in this giant cage and a noise coming from above her.
Your her owner and only you know what's best, of course with all this helpful advice to help you make your decision x
Thank you very much. I do try to keep her best interest in mind but sometimes it's just hard to spend time with her. Especially after getting Little Bear. Just makes me feel like I've replaced her or I'm picking favorites because I dont spend time with her. Even though I know that's not true. It's just a difficult time. Thank you though, it does help hearing other hamster owners tell me that I'm being a good owner.

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Originally Posted by Serendipity7000 View Post
It does sound like she doesn't like the lid being taken off above her. Does it make a noise?
It does make a noise but that's been the case for the past three months. It's only until now that she doesn't like the lid being taken off. Like she knows that when the lid is taken off it means that she's going to be taken out and she's scared of being taken out so she darts around to hide. She's never been the type of hamster to crawl on my hand to get out. I've always just taken her out and she's been okay with it. She's never acted this scared about being out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leila0420 View Post
Hi Oatmeal_Cupcake I think I'm going to join everyone in saying that maybe the detolf is not the best cage for such a nervy hamster like your Aria. Although I'm with Piebald in thinking that swapping her and Little Bear's cage around might not be such a good idea because it will smell like him and that could be fairly unsettling for her. If she was used to being in an opaque bin cage the clear glass of the Detolf might be making her feel very exposed. As an intermediate measure could you possibly drape a blanket/ towel round the majority of the cage or put large pieces of cardboard around the edge so that she isn't visible from the outside?

This also reminded me a little bit of Agent Spectacles thread. He's obviously another nervy ham that doesn't like being picked up so his owners built him some platforms so that if he wants to come out for play time he can climb up and make the decision whether to come out or not himself... (Agent Spectacles Thread) Maybe you could make her something that leads into the playpen you want to use and she if she adventures out in her own time?
I actually keep grass mats on the glass side of the detolf. The other side has wallpaper to make it feel less open. I also have a long piece of fabric that lays over the front of the detolf during the day.

Thank you very much! I'll be sure to take a look at that thread after work today.
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Old 07-07-2015, 04:11 PM   #14
Lexieshamster
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

Hi Oatmeal Cupcake - thought I'd put my two pennies worth in. I'm in the put her back in the bin cage camp. I'm sure you could get rid of the smell with washing and some pet safe disinfectant - and like you say, there was another hamster in there before and this didn't bother her. These things come to mind for me with why she had become scared:

1) Maybe the extra space of the detolf makes Aria less motivated to come out (it would be investing to see if you notice any changes in Little Bear if you do swap them over).
2) Some hamsters just don't like glass cages due to the feeling exposed thing.
2) She may have become less sociable from being handled less after the falling incident. I know if I go away for just a few days Neville does this.
3) The smell of Little Bear in your hands (this can be picked up even after washing- my gerbils won't come near me after I've handled Neville) is perhaps now a factor when combined with the above.

I'd swap them over and restart the taming process after she's settled back into the bin cage. Do the taming before you've handled Little Bear and wash them extra extra well if not. Rub some of her substrate on your hands too.

Don't feel bad about spending more time with Little Bear. You're doing the best you can for both of them and clearly have their best interests at heart. I spend way more time with Neville than I do with my gerbils because they simply don't like being handled or being out of their cage and I often used wonder what I was doing wrong and feel guilty so I can identify with what you're going through.
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Old 07-07-2015, 06:31 PM   #15
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

I think it's a good point that she is probably aware of Little Bear. In fact, although I know her behavior change doesn't track exactly with his arrival, it may be the better explanation for it. If that's the case she will hopefully settle. I wondered too-- doesn't the bin open from the top? Or does it have a side door? (Some people make doors with old cage parts). Do have a look at the Agent Spectacles thread. xx
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Old 07-08-2015, 12:55 AM   #16
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

Right now I'm in a living situation where I'm living with my boyfriends brother while we get on our feet a bit and find our own place. That should be between 3-6 months. I want to get out sooner but the boyfriend insists we take our time.

Anyways, right now we've got a room and outside of our room is a makes shift living room. There's rooms in the basement but it's not a basement but rather an extension of the house. Hopefully that makes sense. So I am able to bring the detolf out for Little Bear and keep Aria in my room, it's quieter in there. However, my boyfriends brother and his wife want to remodel the downstairs bathroom. Meaning that everything in the living room down stairs needs to be moved. This would include the detolf. Right now it would be easier to move the bin cage than it would be to move the detolf with how crowded the downstairs is. I really don't know when they are planning on starting the bathroom but I'm going to talk with them about it. If they are going to put it off for months on end then I'm just going to bring the detolf out.

Speaking of which, I still have the bin I used for Aria during the move up here. I was thinking about trying how she does in that bin before making an official switch between hamsters. That way I can also keep her in my room.

So here is the odd thing I wanted to tell you guys. Aria LOVES being outdoors. She is fearless out there. All she wants to do is explore. I've never let her walk in the grass because there are SO many spiders out there. I literally see them as I walk on the grass. Anyways, she's very calm out there. She's only ever nervous inside the house. It doesn't really matter what room it is. Once she's outside she's fine. I actually... tried something and I took her outside today. She was totally cool with it and wasn't nervous at all. She was walking calmly on me and everything. So I don't know... maybe there's just something about the house that she doesn't like.

The other thing I did today was rearrange her detolf. I gave her more cover and hidey-holes in the inside of the detolf. I checked up on her a couple minutes ago and she was running in her saucer.

So this is what I'm thinking. Overall, she must not like the open space of the detolf, at least not during the day because even before this episode she would still be quick about being out during the day. I'm starting to think that because of the last scare on the bed she might be associating coming out of the detolf with that event. Like it's going to happen every time. I also think this because she's not scared of taking treats from me hand or the sound of my voice. So I'm wondering, if I make her outings from the detolf a positive experience again, like going outside, maybe she will overcome the scare that she had. Any thoughts on this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lexieshamster View Post
Hi Oatmeal Cupcake - thought I'd put my two pennies worth in. I'm in the put her back in the bin cage camp. I'm sure you could get rid of the smell with washing and some pet safe disinfectant - and like you say, there was another hamster in there before and this didn't bother her. These things come to mind for me with why she had become scared:

1) Maybe the extra space of the detolf makes Aria less motivated to come out (it would be investing to see if you notice any changes in Little Bear if you do swap them over).
2) Some hamsters just don't like glass cages due to the feeling exposed thing.
2) She may have become less sociable from being handled less after the falling incident. I know if I go away for just a few days Neville does this.
3) The smell of Little Bear in your hands (this can be picked up even after washing- my gerbils won't come near me after I've handled Neville) is perhaps now a factor when combined with the above.

I'd swap them over and restart the taming process after she's settled back into the bin cage. Do the taming before you've handled Little Bear and wash them extra extra well if not. Rub some of her substrate on your hands too.

Don't feel bad about spending more time with Little Bear. You're doing the best you can for both of them and clearly have their best interests at heart. I spend way more time with Neville than I do with my gerbils because they simply don't like being handled or being out of their cage and I often used wonder what I was doing wrong and feel guilty so I can identify with what you're going through.
Thank you very much, I actually didn't know some of these things. I'll be sure to keep all of this in mind. It's good to hear that I'm not the only one that has gone through something like this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Piebald View Post
I think it's a good point that she is probably aware of Little Bear. In fact, although I know her behavior change doesn't track exactly with his arrival, it may be the better explanation for it. If that's the case she will hopefully settle. I wondered too-- doesn't the bin open from the top? Or does it have a side door? (Some people make doors with old cage parts). Do have a look at the Agent Spectacles thread. xx
I used to have two bins stacked on each other with a ramp leading to the one on top. The bottom had a door. The top one had a lid. I did take a look at Agent Spectacles thread. The only problem with this would be that she chews on the mesh that is on the lids. Besides being worried about her teeth, she'd make a lot of noise in the room at night and she sleeps in out room.
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Old 07-08-2015, 01:02 AM   #17
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

Absolutely making coming out of the detolf a fun experience would be helpful I think
That is weird about her being calm outside. Maybe she's just a one person ham and has trouble with all the other human smells. That's a good reason to try and keep her in your room if true. Playtime in the old bin might be good to see what she thinks of it. Xx
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Old 07-08-2015, 07:07 AM   #18
Pebbles82
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

Charlie can be like that - he was always so nervous in his cage and out of it, but was quite happy upstairs in the bedroom and in his pet carrier. Maybe they just need a day out to chill and recharge like humans sometimes lol! A change of scene. That sounds like a good idea having more hidey places in the detolf. Those big cork logs and tunnels look good for hidey places I think and maybe you could hang a grass hammock across the top of part of it to make it darker underneath, or add a couple of shelves on tall legs with a grass hamcok strung between them. Sorry! That sounds like a lot of work and expense! I should keep going with the busy cage layout and lots of tubes and hideaways.

Is the house particularly noisy? Or stuffy with the heat? Maybe that's another reason she liked being outside. Or just the sense of freedom.
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Old 07-08-2015, 08:31 PM   #19
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

It's a little too early to tell but it seems like she might be coming around a bit with being taken outside and redoing her detolf. Only time will tell for now.
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Old 07-09-2015, 10:26 PM   #20
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Default Re: Hamster paranoia leads to hamster guilt

Aria is doing better now that I've started to take her outside. She doesn't seem as nervous but I also don't feel that she's made a full recovery.

I also baked her some treats with nutritional yeast to help with the stress.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serendipity7000 View Post
Charlie can be like that - he was always so nervous in his cage and out of it, but was quite happy upstairs in the bedroom and in his pet carrier. Maybe they just need a day out to chill and recharge like humans sometimes lol! A change of scene. That sounds like a good idea having more hidey places in the detolf. Those big cork logs and tunnels look good for hidey places I think and maybe you could hang a grass hammock across the top of part of it to make it darker underneath, or add a couple of shelves on tall legs with a grass hamcok strung between them. Sorry! That sounds like a lot of work and expense! I should keep going with the busy cage layout and lots of tubes and hideaways.

Is the house particularly noisy? Or stuffy with the heat? Maybe that's another reason she liked being outside. Or just the sense of freedom.
The house is noisy during the day. Our room is the quietest in the house and that's where she's at. I've got a 6 month old who is 50/50 on crying all day. Then a 2 year old that is always stomping around, screaming and making noise upstairs. Not my kids but also not much I can do about it given the current living situation.

The room gets a little stuffy at night but she doesn't seem to mind it because I hear her running around.

I really couldn't guess why she likes it out there or why it's helping. I'm just glad that it is making a difference.
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